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Official Workflow Case Study - Show us your pain!

Discussion in 'Editor & General Support' started by willgoldstone, Mar 1, 2019.

  1. Trindenberg

    Trindenberg

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2017
    Posts:
    304
    Sometimes I get these weird memory crashes, possibly Profiler related (I'm in 2022.1 messing with VS Interpreter so issues to be expected). Unity tells me I haven't got quantum memory installed!
     
  2. cloverme

    cloverme

    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2018
    Posts:
    156
    Unity: Use the assetstore to add functionality to your development! (Shows amazing screenshot of fire and trees and an amazing game).

    Experience:
    You decide to add a tree with snow to your scene.
    You download an asset which has a 3rd party shader for HDRP 7.2
    Three months later you update your project to 2020.3, which has HDRP 10.6
    Custom shader no longers works because HDRP is not forward compatible
    Asset store developer says an update is coming soon, so you move onto other development.
    You decide to add fire to your torch, requiring another 3rd party shader.
    Six months later an update comes out for the custom tree shader to HDRP 10.7
    You update to HDRP 10.7 so that you can use the tree again.
    Now you discover that the fire shader only works on HDRP 10.6
    Asset store developer says an update is coming soon for the fire shader, so you move onto other development.
    <repeat loop for everything requiring an HDRP shader>
     
  3. Innovine

    Innovine

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2017
    Posts:
    490
    Yeah, but its called UNITY. What do you want, something unified???
     
  4. laaaa

    laaaa

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2015
    Posts:
    4
    My pain is I am constantly getting bugs in Unity, magic enable this optionb disable this look at this long video try the magic non explained fix that did work on the previous version but does not work for me constant crashes constant blocked builds constant frustration
     
  5. Innovine

    Innovine

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2017
    Posts:
    490
    I cant even select things in the Scene view now.
     
  6. Hannibal_Leo

    Hannibal_Leo

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2012
    Posts:
    493
    I am using Unity since 8 years now and except for version 2019.2 (I think), I never encountered such bugs. IDK if it was 2019.2 but one version was very unstable, constantly crashing - but they fixed it with newer releases.

    This thread is more of a "I am using unity since a long time, I know what I am doing and this is my workflow pain and it could be fixed with [insert feature]"-thread.
    Bugs should be sent as Bug Reports, using the Button in the Editor.
    -> https://support.unity.com/hc/en-us/articles/206336985-How-do-I-submit-a-bug-report

    And btw. I am so, so happy how this thread turned out, a lot of the suggestions here are acutally implemented.
    • contextual shortcuts
    • scene view overlays
    • unified scale in transform inspector
    • performance optimisations
    • copy and paste in Hierarchy and Project window
    • property inspector
    • reorderable lists
    • ..
     
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2022
    SisusCo and Lars-Steenhoff like this.
  7. mgear

    mgear

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2010
    Posts:
    8,120
  8. Innovine

    Innovine

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2017
    Posts:
    490
    There's an icon in the Layers panel which disables selection. Took me ages to find it.
     
  9. Ne0mega

    Ne0mega

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2018
    Posts:
    560
    I thought for a long time garbage collection was an issue causing lag spikes in my game. Turns out it was "other", specifically "editor profile".

    Why did I get those confused?

    Well, the profiler, for some reason, for nine colors, chose to use four which are a shade of cyan or green, two or three of which are a shade of olive green / gray, and then there is an orange.

    It's only nine colors, guys/gals/otherkin. You really could have used 9 very high contrast colors.
     
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2022
  10. Ne0mega

    Ne0mega

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2018
    Posts:
    560
    You can ctrl click on a texture in a material, to view it a little closer. Instead of a 64 x 64, you get a 128 x 128 (maybe 256 x 256). either way, it is pretty much useless in most cases. Need a zoom or button to increase size.

    there also is no "X" in the upper right to close the window. So I either often hit the "A" or look around somewhere on screen to click to make the window close that wont mess with the game or what I was viewing in the inspector originally.
     
  11. LightStriker

    LightStriker

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2013
    Posts:
    2,709
    Pain? Almost everyday on console will crash if played long enough.
    Unity has no compacting garbage collector, even if the standard .NET offer this feature.
     
  12. TheVirtualMunk

    TheVirtualMunk

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2019
    Posts:
    127
    I'll add just a bunch of simple small issues with the project view that I really would expect to have been solved after using unity for 5 years;
    • With the project view focused, you should be able to press any key and jump to files/folders starting with that key.
    • Mouse button 4 and 5 should behave like back/forward buttons.
    • We should be able to control whether the project hierarchy view expands or stays locked when opening a folder. I would love to have the hierarchy view only displaying level 1 no matter where I am in the project view. Right now I have to alt-click close the "assets" folder and reopen it after every folder interaction to get the structure I want.
    These are features of almost all file explorers and they never made it to Unitys.
     
  13. Ne0mega

    Ne0mega

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2018
    Posts:
    560
    I think I've seen it before mentioned here, with people saying how you can change it, not sure.

    But probably the most aggravating thing for me of all is the scene view camera clipping when I want to get up close, detailed look at things. I start zooming in in scene view to look at something, and it clips out way too early. I don't know if this is because I am looking at tiny things on giant maps or what, but it kills me, and I have never been able to figure out why its that way, or how to get around it.
     
  14. FU_JPS

    FU_JPS

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2012
    Posts:
    12
    We work on a huge project with tons of FBX's and textures. Lots of characters, costumes, animations, etc. One of our big pain points is project startup time. It takes us an average of 10 minutes (!) just for the "Initialize Asset Database" phase of startup, and that's before any actual asset importing takes place!

    Peeking around in Resource Monitor it looks like this is where Unity loads
    Library/ArtifactDB
    , which is a 2GB file in our project. I suspect there's no easy fix for this without some kind of massive rewrite of Unity's asset database internals, but I thought I'd share anyway.

    One obvious suggestion is SSD's for everyone (I can already hear the higher-ups: "SSD's for DATA STORAGE!? We just bought the artists 10TB HDD's because their 6TB drives were filling up!"), but to be honest it still takes forever even on an SSD...
     
  15. Baste

    Baste

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2013
    Posts:
    5,965
    Hit F to focus some object that's about the size of what you want to look at, that resets the near clip plane of the scene camera.

    There is for sure a bug where the near clip of the camera, and other camera settings in general, just drift. It's always been there.
     
  16. Ne0mega

    Ne0mega

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2018
    Posts:
    560
    I do that all the time, but it does not help.

    I am guessing part of the problem is a map 500 units large, and things on the map 0.5 units large.
    Also, mixing UI with 3d objects is part of it too, probably. Whatever it is, I have never been able to get it to work well, at all.

    Mostly, it is when trying to look at, say the collider or navmesh on my map. I don't know if it is because I spawn those at 0,0,0 and Unity is assuming meshes with center pivots or what.
     
    hurleybird likes this.
  17. Ne0mega

    Ne0mega

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    Feb 18, 2018
    Posts:
    560
    I just loaded a project from my backup HDD, and it took way more time to load than from SSD. (by a magnitude of I'd say about 4).
     
  18. TheVirtualMunk

    TheVirtualMunk

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2019
    Posts:
    127
    upload_2022-3-15_9-11-49.png
    Have you tried changing the clipping planes manually?
     
    Sinister-Design likes this.
  19. Hannibal_Leo

    Hannibal_Leo

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2012
    Posts:
    493
    Have you tried using addressables? Maybe it would help? IDK

    Or having the ArtifactDB (what kind of DB is it?) outside of Unity and accessing it from code? Then in a BuildPostprocessor adding it manually to the build/resources folder?
     
  20. Flow-Fire-Games

    Flow-Fire-Games

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2015
    Posts:
    301
    One small thing that happens all the time is mistaking the console for the Project search bar
    So many times I write in the console by mistake because it looks the same at a glance
    This could have some more visible indicator in the search bar
     
    TheVirtualMunk likes this.
  21. FU_JPS

    FU_JPS

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2012
    Posts:
    12
    It's not one of our assets; it's a file that Unity auto-generates in the Library folder. I have no idea what format it's in; my guess is that it's the main mapping of all the assets in the project (the Assets folder) to their internal cached representations in the Library/Artifacts folder, but only a Unity dev could say for sure.
     
  22. FU_JPS

    FU_JPS

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2012
    Posts:
    12
    Oh, yeah, our project definitely loads a lot faster on an SSD! It still takes a few minutes due to the sheer content volume though. A couple of our machines are using SSD's but the majority of the artists are using 6TB-and-up HDD's for their data. I guess I'll see if I can convince whoever's in charge to buy some for everyone...
     
  23. TheVirtualMunk

    TheVirtualMunk

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2019
    Posts:
    127
    upload_2022-3-25_11-36-21.png
    Oh another one - when hovering over the "window-tab-bar", we should be able to use the mouse wheel to scroll through. It's such a hassle to move the pointer over to those small arrows. :rolleyes:
     
  24. Bagazi

    Bagazi

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2018
    Posts:
    500
    Hi,is there any possibility to save the size and position for Unity Editor windows?

    My desktop screen was a wide one( 3440*1440 ),So I set position and size for every Editor window(Including the main one),which are suitable for me. But it looks like the position and size info for each window was not recorded in saved layout I guess,cause I need to reset those positions everytime when reopen Unity..(Loading saved layout was not helpful)


    upload_2022-4-8_12-11-46.png
     

    Attached Files:

  25. vertxxyz

    vertxxyz

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2014
    Posts:
    88
    Clicking an object field should bring the Project window into focus if it's not already.
    If that's not possible, make it so a double-click does it!
    It's extremely frustrating to have to manually manage tabs to perform basic navigation like this.
     
    Ne0mega likes this.
  26. vertxxyz

    vertxxyz

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2014
    Posts:
    88
    The backspace shortcut used in the Project window should either be changed to be a bindable shortcut, or it should not fire if holding a function key.

    There are plenty of shortcuts that need porting, but there should at least be a pass to remove integrated bindings that take up a key +combinations from being usable shortcuts!
     
  27. Flow-Fire-Games

    Flow-Fire-Games

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2015
    Posts:
    301
    One thing I really want to hone in again, which is such an essential and key thing done hundreds of times:

    When you CTRL+D duplicate something in the hierarchy
    It keeps inserting it at the very bottom of the entire hierarchy
    This can often be hundreds or even thousands of assets apart from the original
    and warrant a lot of scrolling and confusion, reordering of your hierarchy to fit back into view and all sorts of fiddling and is just very messy. This is also so easy to fix. I do understand code inserting at the bottom but by manual arrangement it really should not.

    This can also cause unwanted behavior. Per example if I duplicate a background, it will insert it at the bottom of my hierarchy, and be infront of the rest, hiding the other elements, while it should just be.

    A manual CTRL-D copy should always be next to the original, and inserted on the next below position. This is also the behavior of most other softwares I know.
     
  28. Flow-Fire-Games

    Flow-Fire-Games

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2015
    Posts:
    301
    Also please can we fix the text - we have enough space in the Project window to display 2 lines without even adjusting the spacing even on the smallest possible setting!



    Its been over 10 years and half of everyones names are cut-off for no reason.
    This is such a fundamental part of the project and the entire engine and would be such a low hanging fruit to improve
     
    pbritton, Saniell, IOU_RAY and 8 others like this.
  29. DearUnityPleaseAddSerializableDictionaries

    DearUnityPleaseAddSerializableDictionaries

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2014
    Posts:
    126
    Hi Unity Team, is there an update whether Serializable Dictionaries will be on the roadmap without having to resort to workarounds? This is the biggest pain affecting my workflow for 8 years and it still is with the latest version of Unity. The quoted post has support from other users. Thank you.
     
  30. Innovine

    Innovine

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2017
    Posts:
    490
    upload_2022-6-26_15-26-28.png

    An hour... seriously??
     
    awesomedata and Bordeaux_Fox like this.
  31. Innovine

    Innovine

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2017
    Posts:
    490
    It took them 8 years to add variable speed to the scene camera... it's not like these quality of life changes bring in any immediate improvement to the share price, so no, you can't have it. But instead you can have one of these things: https://unity.com/products
     
  32. Bordeaux_Fox

    Bordeaux_Fox

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2018
    Posts:
    589
    First things this morning was only to change one TextMeshPro atlas (I switched the rendering mode to SDF) and now Unity got stuck on entering Play Mode. Something must be really broken in Unity.
    I lost so many time waiting on the Reload Script Assemblies. Basically my productivity is cut into half if not even more, atleast with the 2021 LTS.
    Is Unity aware how much financial (time == money) loss is created for devs around the globe with such a slow editor?
     

    Attached Files:

    andreyefimov2010 likes this.
  33. Saniell

    Saniell

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2015
    Posts:
    56
    Imma go with a little list. Sorry if some suggestions will repeat what was already mentioned.
    First of all, it would be really nice to improve object field, since it's kinda bad.
    • There is no "clear" in context menu. So you may have to scroll A LOT to select "empty"
    • When using on assets and type filter is MonoBehvaiour, you can not select prefabs, but dragging them works for some reason. Which means you must always use typeof(GameObject) for prefabs which leads to mess in object picker.
    • Object picker should use grid-based layout by default for Textures. And in general, maybe it should remember layout by type and not by last usage?
    • This should be built in feature, better with some sort of API so you could see this selection process in your own tools and interact with it (e.g. filter your own selection suggestion based on whatever user currently wants)
    • Just clicking on stuff once in object picker changes value of a field. Which is kinda annoying because you may have custom editor that does something when field is changed, but I just wanted to preview asset
    • Why SearchService.ShowObjectPicker is not used by default? It looks like an improvement in every single way except speed. It would be amazing if this picker would show results instantly like default one and replaced it eventually
    General notes:
    • Assets/Create menu is a nightmare. As for now it has more options than my screen can even display and I don't even have that many packages. Maybe we could have better context menus, similar to ones in Blender, that look nice and have icons to help navigation? Also maybe you could even include search there
    • Maybe we could have inspector locking mode that locks on scene objects. Meaning if you select scene object then inspector changes accordingly, but when selecting in project view then inspector stays the same. This is also useful when you're assigning fields and want to preview assets. I'd suggest you then open assets using "Properties..." conext menu option
    • Currently we have 2 different snapping tools in scene view for some reason. They have different snapping sizes, and one works only when holding CTRL and other only when you rotation pivot is set to global. Why? And also why don't I always see snapping values? Why not simplify it to something like this? Please stop abusing dropdowns for scene overlays
    upload_2022-6-29_11-26-14.png

    • Even better, one of these snapping options is not accessable through API because it's internal
    • When you close the scene window it looses all overlays you've opened for some reason, so you have to setup them all over again
    • If scene overlay on top of the window gets overflown, you can't scroll it
    • Undo history window is not a drop down window. Which is understandable since you may want to dock it, but it makes it annoying for how I use it, making me press X each time. Why not allow us to turn undo history into dockable window by using context menu or button or some other thing? This is totally possible to do using current API.
    • Stack traces in console window are selectable but also clickable. Which is understandable, but sometimes I find myself confused whether or not did unity actually register my click or VisualStudio just being slow. So maybe some better feedback?
    • Also if unity seeks to improve console window (which seems to be the case looking at roadmap) you should really look into what needle-console does. The only problem with it is that it's slow (in my experience)
    • Maybe we could have icons for Project folders? Special icon for test folder, editor folder, etc with ability to set your own custom icon like you do with Game Objects
    • Speaking of custom icons, please consider allowing to make your own preview for prefabs. There are a lot of prefabs that have no MeshRenderer but I still would like them to have at least some component icon, to not be this "blue cube" that tells you nothing
    As a side note. Can someone from Unity FINALLY look at this thread? The way unity ignores so many people is just not right
     
  34. Innovine

    Innovine

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2017
    Posts:
    490
    I justr upgraded from a GTX1070 to an RTX3080 and my build performance is much worse!!
     
    awesomedata likes this.
  35. Innovine

    Innovine

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    Aug 6, 2017
    Posts:
    490
    The overrides list does not have a search. I have to manually scroll through literally thousands of lines to find what i want
     
  36. Innovine

    Innovine

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2017
    Posts:
    490
    Of course Unity cares. They give you all these nice things: https://unity.com/products
     
    MaxRoetzler likes this.
  37. LightStriker

    LightStriker

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2013
    Posts:
    2,709
    I thought you were serious for a second.
     
    andreyefimov2010 likes this.
  38. Indie_Core

    Indie_Core

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2021
    Posts:
    6
    Just trying to get myself familiar with editor scripting, set up some serialized properties managed to read non-array/non-list properties with a kind of hacky in my opinion solution with property.intValue/boolValue/floatValue/stringValue etc. but i see no possibilities to read property that's array/list and it makes me go nuts.

    - and its 2k22
     
    awesomedata likes this.
  39. evyatron

    evyatron

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2014
    Posts:
    79
    Trying to get accustomed to using new APIs and functions - specifically Search and Toolbars - I find the documentation lacking and sometimes confusing, and the features themselves not ready for production use.

    Just today I wanted to add a Dropdown to my Toolbar Overlay.

    Here are the docs search results for "toolbarvverlay dropdown".
    This is the first result - no mention of "dropdown" at all.
    A few results down there's the generic ToolbarOverlay, if you read through all the code in there you can spot it's using
    EditorToolbarDropdownToggle (as a developer I don't understand if I need that - as the class name has Toggle in it, and I just want a dropdown).
    After finding what I actually wanted - I realised it's essentially just a button with an On Click event that creates and shows a GenericMenu. Is that what I need to be using? What's the purpose of this class being a "Dropdown" if I'm listening to a click event and showing a menu? Why is the menu not aligned to the button showing it (like normal dropdowns)? As a programmer I would expect the workflow to be something like:
    1. I create a class and inherit from EditorToolbarDropdown
    2. I start typing "override" into my IDE, one of the results should be "Get Children", the other "OptionSelected"
    3. I implement those two - and done - I get a dropdown behaving like normal editor dropdowns.

    This might seem nit-picky about a very specific thing - but I find similar issues with any "new" Unity feature I'm trying to test. As someone with a lot of Unity experience, it's very frustrating to keep telling my team "yeah that feature is cool but we don't use it because of this and this and that". (we'd love to use the Plastic integration, but it crashes the editor and sometimes prevents entering play mode, which is less than ideal)
     
    sand_lantern and MaxRoetzler like this.
  40. MechaWolf99

    MechaWolf99

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2017
    Posts:
    236
    Not really the correct thread for this as it is meant of the UX of the editor, not really the creating process. However a short answer would be GetArrayElementAtIndex(..) and other methods similarly named. A quick google search should give you numerus results of how to do it. Feel free to make a separate thread and @ me if you have more questions or hop on the Unity discord and ask there :)
     
  41. Innovine

    Innovine

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2017
    Posts:
    490
    After 13 pages of peoples pain, perhaps now it is time to turn it around, and have Unity show us what they are doing to fix these specific pains??
     
  42. awesomedata

    awesomedata

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2014
    Posts:
    1,415
    They are buying lots of companies!!!


    Can't you see that?


    New companies will totally help the basic nuances of your daily independent game developer workflows!

    The future is BRIGHT!!! -- SO BRIGHT, I tell you!!!


    SO BRIGHT it might just BLIND YOU and BURN YOUR EYES OUT.

    Didn't you know that Speedtree will fix and futureproof tool development workflows like ShortcutManagement and Workspace API? And Weta will make HDRP easier to use? Oh and don't forget that new IronSource merger will make app development easier by making you able to bleed more money out of your whales and make it easier to manipulate their basic human instincts, also making Unity more money in the process when you and I successfully complete and publish a project!! -- Who cares how many external companies and applications you must use to do that!! -- Unity is easy!!!!!


    How clueless could one person be?
    Didn't you know we all use Unity to make AAA movies and throwaway mobile apps! -- And Unity is sooo easy to use that we _always_ complete our projects with it -- and always before our spirit dies or our motivation to continue runs out due never having to worry about half-complete workflow and tooling solutions or extremely sparse (or completely nonexistent) documentation!!! -- Besides, the Asset Store exists for that sort of stuff, and people ONLY upload useful solutions there!!

    Workflow pains don't matter! -- We ALL just pay somebody else to create tools and functionality for us and all is right in the world!!! :):):)

    What indie game company can't afford to do that?? -- Surely all the important gamedevs can do this! -- Why can't you??


    Who needs a game engine???


    Just remember:

    Don't do anything _too_ ambitious (like trying to implement large open streaming multiplayer experiences -- Gigaya wasn't even that, and we still couldn't finish it!) -- You gotta make a lot of tools to do that kind of thing, and Unity isn't really good at that sort of stuff anyway.

    Why don't you just go make a movie or a simple mobile app instead?


    PS: -- A mobile app is a "game" too!! -- Who needs quality immersive game experiences anymore! -- Especially with the new movement toward VR and XR devices! -- We need more 2D mobile developers and big-budget 2D movie creators!!! -- Otherwise Unity won't be profitable!!!



    /s
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2022
  43. chrisk

    chrisk

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2009
    Posts:
    700
    I remember saying the following many many years ago, summarizing Unity.

    "Unity is Stubborn, Incompetent, and Lazy"

    It is still valid these days and nothing has changed.
    Actually, it's getting worse after going IPO. Their only interest is to keep the investor remain interested. The developers are second-class citizens.
    If, perhaps, their stock dips below $10, they will turn their head around and try to find what's going on.

    Anyway, dealing with Unity was unbearably painful and I left for Unreal a few years ago vowing not to piss toward Unity unless something (at least one of the three above??) changes.
    The biggest pain now is to watch Unity getting screwed by THE (fall) GUY and it's getting worse and worse.
    Yeah, it's possible for a big company gets screwed by a single person. We all watched what happened to Intel.

    My last hope? I don't expect Unity will fix all the pains anytime soon.
    But at least we can remain hopeful that THE GUY gets removed.
    It will be the sign that Unity is trying to change and we will all celebrate then.

    My two cents!
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2022
    IOU_RAY and sand_lantern like this.
  44. Innovine

    Innovine

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2017
    Posts:
    490
    Can't even rage quit properly...
    upload_2022-8-28_22-24-55.png
     
  45. SoftwareGeezers

    SoftwareGeezers

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2013
    Posts:
    725
    Remember the days when wanting to stop meant flicking a power switch? Bang, done! Now it's ask permission and wait a while or three.