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What do I say to....

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by galent, May 15, 2012.

  1. tatoforever

    tatoforever

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    I always try to avoid such threads, but if for some reason i got into (and find something that feels wrong), i try simply to be objective and most of the time i delete what I'm typing and get back to do what ever i was doing (specially if what I'm about to say will possibly start some war). XD
    At least, typing and deleting makes me feel that i told what i had to say! :D
     
  2. Adam-Buckner

    Adam-Buckner

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    Galent:

    There are at least two different issues here.

    Minimally, I see these as the threads where the OPs make a statement type post that attracts trolls, and OPs that ask questions.

    When it comes to the latter (OPs asking a question), there is certainly less control. "Can I make a real game with Unity? I've been coding for 3 months now, and can kick anyone's aspect when it comes 'gramming!" - Well, it is much harder to control this type of thread. The OP *did* ask a question, and the answers can be awfully harsh. Here I would fall back on "If you have something to say, say it politely". There is no need to be rude or punishing. If you feel compelled to answer the question: Be polite and professional. If the OP is not being polite, report them; we'll deal with them.

    When it comes to the former (OPs making a statement - usually posting for Team Creation) then I find these threads should be easier for people to deal with... primarily by not posting. "I'm the CEO and President Elite (1337_B055) of "Obsidian Ops™®" and I'm looking for coders, artists and level designers. You must be a ninja with years of skillz. I will provide the ideas for this Zombie-Pwning, WoW-Killing, MMO. You'll be rich when we take over teh world!" At this point I fall back on "If you have nothing polite to say, don't say it". Walk away from this. Silence will be the best lesson for this type of person. If he bumps his thread without content, report it; we'll deal with the issue.

    This approach to the two most common types of threads on Collab (and most common on Gossip that go sour) works in so many ways:
    • The thread sinks fast, and is quickly out of sight
    • The OP gets the message that the community is not interested
    • If the OP learns his lesson, no bridges have been burned
    • No one trolls the threads, so no responders* look like idiots
    • The forum section is not cluttered with carp, and people can see the legitimate posts

    *I think this is important to note, as some of the sparring that goes on in many threads is less about the OP than trolls fighting for territory. Trolling in many ways makes the *responder* look as bad or worse than the OP.
     
  3. ivanzu

    ivanzu

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    That company is registered I was doing some modeling for them at that time and he came and said that he registered the company.

    .......
    If I don't have something clever to say then I keep my mouth shut and that's what trolls should do.
     
    Last edited: May 16, 2012
  4. TylerPerry

    TylerPerry

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    I though you had left earth or something....

    That is a blob fish.

    I troll, but i dont get angry though i just like angering people because i am one messed up kid.
     
  5. AdmiralAckbar

    AdmiralAckbar

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    That's some great community spirit you're showing.

    Adam (Little Angel) hit the nail on the head when he said it's the responders who often come out looking worse.

    Writing a bad recruitment post on your first go is not a huge crime, it's a mistake. If these posts where left alone, it should make the OP consider why, and possibly improve things next time. If they don't improve over time then it's a different matter. However deliberately baiting someone shows a definite lack of maturity and professionalism.
     
  6. TylerPerry

    TylerPerry

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    Well, i try to help people in the scripting thread as much as i can in return i ask for help, personally i think asking for a large group to make a game for them is a far more sinister act then infuriating some people.

    I generally just avoid that section of the forums unless Ive had a particular bad day at school, but that makes me sad as i strongly think that it could and should be the best part of these forums, although only like 1% are actually decent threads.
     
  7. Adam-Buckner

    Adam-Buckner

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    Titanity:

    Good and viable discussions on games, assets and game design are to be encouraged. Trolling and angering people are not.

    Your work is good, Titanty. You have a definite style and a clear talent. You should be building a rep based around the work you have done and the assets and games you are making, not from volume of material posted while trolling other users on the forum.

    I really like your work.

    I'd like to see that good work in your posts as well.

    The more we ignore threads that are damaged, damaging, or full of carp - the quicker they will fade. Then the ratio of carp to magic-unicorn-ponies will fall on the forum, especially in the collaboration section.
     
  8. galent

    galent

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    Ahh, I must be getting old, I'm getting nostalgic for the old days ... or to paraphrase a quote that seems to fit:

    "Was a time [trolling] would find you hanging by your thumbs in the dungeons. God, I miss the screaming." - Filch

    lol
     
  9. AdmiralAckbar

    AdmiralAckbar

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    I agree that the notion of a development sweatshop, full of coders and artists working like galley slaves for an almighty ideas guy, who's hell bent on making loadsamoney, is a little misguided. Though anyone who's worked at a Games Studio during a crunch period might find that analogy familiar ;). In reality this is unlikely to get off the ground as ultimately you all have a choice to join or not join any Collaboration project, if the terms are terrible 'You do all the work I get all the money and credit!' then no one will be interested. If no one is interested then in theory no one needs to post on the thread and it sinks off the front page.
     
  10. TylerPerry

    TylerPerry

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    But there are so many that any actual good projects get pushed off of the front page to quickly to pick up any fire.
     
  11. Torsh

    Torsh

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    I always try to put a positive spin on my responses. Sometimes a negative tone gets in there but you'll see me responding with "looks great" or "do you need a writer?" Even if my gut feeling is neutral.
     
  12. n0mad

    n0mad

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    Logic 101 : Trolling a thread will only push those good projects further off the front page.
     
  13. TylerPerry

    TylerPerry

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    But ill post on the goodness aswell, then it is balanced. anyway ill try not to troll anymore :)
     
  14. AdmiralAckbar

    AdmiralAckbar

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    Made all the more fitting as it's from a school caretaker :).
     
  15. stimarco

    stimarco

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    Indeed, but not everyone has learned to override every one of their natural impulses; people can be OCD about correcting ignorance as much as others get OCD about cleanliness.

    My original point was that any forum designed on the assumption that this is something every forum member will be able to control easily is doomed to failure. I sure as hell can't; it's like a Pavlovian response. And it's not limited to the Internet, hence my point about the XKCD gag: many people get that urge to correct falsehoods and misinformation in real life too.

    That kind of activity is the very foundation of politics, which primarily revolves around telling the other guy he's a two-faced liar.
     
  16. justinlloyd

    justinlloyd

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    I had to pop back to make sure I didn't leave the stove on.
     
  17. Integria

    Integria

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    Three kinds of threads;
    1) Reasonable
    2) Flame-war potential
    3) Outright flamewar

    Three examples;
    1) What are the strengths of Softimage in a modelling workflow?
    2) Softimage vs 3ds Max vs Maya
    3) WHY 3DS MAX BEVEL WORK S*** COMPARED TO SOFTIMAGE?!?!!!!

    And the relevant responses;
    1) Explain the pros and cons. We all know they are there, if you actually have an experience with the situation, or the product.
    2) Consider the situation;
    2a) I'm drunk. I'll just post: "3DS MAX IS SCHEIT!!!1!!"
    2b) I'm sober. I'll link to a more informed version of the same question (see 1), or refrain from posting.
    3) Refrain from posting. I believe we all know why.

    Meh, it all winds up the same; "Don't say something, unless you have something worthwhile to say."

    Questions always tend to be, regardless of the topic, intelligent, borderline, or provocative.

    Answering provocative questions is useless; don't be snarky in this case, unless you do it for your own amusement. Even so, it will be frowned upon, I'm sure.
    Answering borderline stupid questions, or questions that are merely misinformed, or asked from a lacking basis. These generally aren't answered well in a simple manner. Either you don't answer, or you try to elaborate on the question asked and THEN provide a reasonable explanation. Answering a question that seems stupid with a stupid answer is, unsurprisingly, stupid.
    Answering an intelligent question... well. If you don't know the answer, you'll most likely be welcome to contribute. If you do know 'an' answer, be open to discussion.

    Who knows, really. Discussion; community. It all bears the stink of 'communication'. Being snarky isn't communication. It's just a damned way of insulting others in a one-way direction. The irony of this post is that I'm ever so guilty of it.

    Most of the idiocy I've seen on here so far come from people trying to learn, without actually trying to learn; people trying to learn coding, based on getting their code corrected by others. People trying to do shaders without any clue how shaders are actually translated and compiled. People trying to...
    There are plenty of idiotic questions. I have several in my head, even as I type this - I just don't start theads over them.
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2012
  18. Adam-Buckner

    Adam-Buckner

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    Please don't answer any questions for your own amusement.


    Yes it is, prime advice.


    Yes it is, prime advice.


    And an astute observation.

    Let's support our community and get them educated.

    Educate them out of their stupidity if they can be educated. Ignore the ones that can't. Work hard trying to find out whom is which.
     
  19. CharlieSamways

    CharlieSamways

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    When i was a wei kipper and just started here i made so many dreadful misrakes and had everyone hating me. Id like to think that now only 70% of you do ;) but the point is. I found that the soul cahing reaponses i recieved were needed. they make you realise 'owh S***. I best not do that' and ive also realised that the ones who sulk about being trolled are the lost causes. Heck, if we we were all lovey dovey to each other nothing would look good. (example would be my s-collect project which i got cmpliments for rven tho it was awful) as far as helping peoPle improve i think they should check out the sticky threads. Everything is there it just seems to go ignored.

    there are a few individals on here that i think are in the position i was. And just as hippo did to me they will be the few i will look over and offer advise too.


    Spelling s atrosious im on an idevice lmao


    Last note: is therd currently any tread stucture guides? If not ill go ahead and create one for je collab section hst could et stickied As i feel structuring threads is something im good at. Im assuming here will already be one.
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2012
  20. Gigiwoo

    Gigiwoo

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    Good question - $100 prize!
    Gigi.
     
  21. FusionGames

    FusionGames

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    Lol. Very interesting thread I must say...
    Personally, I only read the Collab forums when I'm feeling depressed and need a good laugh. I don't post anything there either though...no matter how annoying I find it, unless I can actually offer some decent advice (don't use others' IP without permission etc.). If I had the time to contribute to Collaboration projects then I would...but I don't. Besides, I like to work on my own projects. I think that's the way it is with most of the skilled people here on the Forums(not saying I'm skilled lol...I don't have any work published yet...).