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Unity Tree Billboard Bug!!! with Oculus UNITY WHAT IS GOING ON??

Discussion in 'AR/VR (XR) Discussion' started by superjayman, May 23, 2016.

  1. superjayman

    superjayman

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    What is going on with the Tree Billboard Bug, any fixes???

    I find it ridiculous that Unity has not fixed this issue. For those who are not aware of this issue, Tree Billboards rotations are wacky when you rotate your head to look around, others have pointed this problem out many times and after searching the forums there is still NO SOLUTION INSIGHT??

    WHAT IS GOING ON UNITY??
     
  2. JDMulti

    JDMulti

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    It's an open issue for more then 1.5 years now. Don't expect to see changes very soon. Last Unite Europe ( 2015 ) they told me there was a new guy for terrain development, however he quit the job to go somewhere else. Since then, no progress on terrains. It's one of the features together with video texture that needs some heavy update as soon as possible.
     
  3. superjayman

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    The developer quit, he probably din't know how to fix the billboards( just kiddin).. It is a shame there is no fix, I would like to hear from Unity about this issue and the progress. The issue does not exist with SpeedTree trees however speedtree is awfully slow no matter how I configure the LOD levels.

    Not sure why Unity are implementing orientation of billboards the way they are ,Unity Tree Billboards are aligned with the Camera Direction, when they should be looking or aligned to the (Camera Position - Tree Position) NOT Camera Forward.

    So, please Unity can we get some feedback on this issue.. Cheers
     
  4. creat327

    creat327

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    this has been known for ages and it's amazing it's not fixed yet. It makes VR and terrains completely useless since you have to remove all trees from your scene or risk to get everyone laughing at your game or getting dizzy.

    if at least we got some feedback on when a fix is expected...
     
  5. superjayman

    superjayman

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    Unity FEEDBACK PLEASE ? btw. This issue also effects billboard grass!
     
  6. LIVENDA

    LIVENDA

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    This issue effectively and completely eliminates the ability to use Unity based Trees ( + grass) in VR. speedtree as it stands has major performance issues. Unity, can you please at least acknowledge and perhaps provide some feedback regarding ETA on the fix, thank you.

    Cheers,
    Livenda Labs Pty Ltd
     
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  7. superjayman

    superjayman

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  8. thep3000

    thep3000

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    This has nothing to do with VR mode. It happens in normal mode also (although it is much more noticeable in VR). This is due to the fact that we are rendering a single view specific tree, and then using that for all of the displayed trees.

    At the moment I don't think anyone is actively looking into this. Here is an issue here you can vote on: https://issuetracker.unity3d.com/is...osition-gets-offsetted-by-vr-headset-position
     
  9. Elecman

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  10. creat327

    creat327

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    I wonder if this billboarding thing happen on other engines. I'm going to give it a try.
     
  11. joellang

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  12. mrboembastic

    mrboembastic

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    Still no fix?
     
  13. Eiseno

    Eiseno

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    Still no fix +1 ?
     
  14. eastes

    eastes

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    Looking for solution. Will report back if I find one.

    EDIT: easiest solution was to not use the free speed trees that are on the asset store. I bought the paid version and it doesn't force the Facing leaves which breaks it for VR.
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2017
  15. creat327

    creat327

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    I have the paid version and it has the same issues...
     
  16. matteumayo

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    Does SpeedTree's alpha blending/alpha-to-coverage to remove leaf aliasing work for you all? I cannot get it working no matter what I try. Been trying to fix this for the past week.

    Obviously aliasing on all my trees' leaves kills VR. Would be grateful for any help.
     
  17. trappist-1

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    I can't believe the only option here is no option.. Why would a company not fix such a simple issue if they want to promote the use of VR? This bug alone pretty much destroys immersion for outdoor games and vastly limits the content that can be developed using their engine. Gives me the impression that the developers of Unity are down right lazy (or worse).
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2017
  18. Gibbonuk

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    I too find this very very strange, until the last few days, the unity's front page advertised unity as the next gen VR development tool, yet we cant even use the terrain tree system in VR?
     
  19. KellyJelly

    KellyJelly

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    Hello, I'd like to give everyone an update on this issue. I'm currently working on a solution for VR and monoscopic rendering that will allow you to easily create a billboard asset of any terrain tree. This billboard asset wont constantly be re-rendered each frame which should reduce the apparent motion, it will have a user selectable number of slices that the tree can be viewed from. Unfortunately, there is no perfect solution for rendering billboards very close to the camera without any artifacts, so there will still be some popping/fading as the billboards change between slices.

    I've also noticed there are complaints regarding the orienting of terrain trees. Please note that it is possible to get billboard renderers to orient toward the camera's position (instead of along the camera's forward vector) using the quality option "Billboards face camera position." This is likely the desired behavior for VR, but you will still notice apparent motion as each billboard is being re-rendered each frame using one of the closer 3D meshes as a prototype.

    I've indicated the option in an attached image.

    If you have any more questions or comments, feel free to ask.

    Thanks!
     

    Attached Files:

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  20. trappist-1

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    That's great news! Thanks for the update!
     
  21. Gibbonuk

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    HI, thanks for the update, really glad to hear it is being worked on, but I am going to have to ask the dreaded question as VR is really key right now and is at a vital time to push games and VR applications and for me without this it is completely holding my project back (and it is a large project) and i'm sure many others. So, do you have an idea of when the solution for monoscopic rendering will be available?

    As you already have said, even with the "Billboards face camera position." checked, you still get billboard rending issues.

    Thanks again
     
  22. Ecocide

    Ecocide

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    "Billboards face camera position" does not help at all.

    Please fix this. Not using billboards is not an option.
     
  23. LaneFox

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    Tested this on 5.6.0b11 and it doesn't seem to actually do anything or affect the terrain tree billboards in any way. They still use the forward vector.
     
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  24. Gibbonuk

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    I thought I too had checked this previously to find no effect whatsoever, but after reading the above I doubted myself....

    Had a bit of hope for a short while!
     
  25. KellyJelly

    KellyJelly

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    Interesting. It is definitely the case that it works with billboard renderers. I will investigate.
    Thank you for your feedback.
     
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  26. KellyJelly

    KellyJelly

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    I'm not sure what you mean monoscopic rendering. Is that something unrelated to tree rendering? It is already possible to mirror the left eye to the right eye using camera.stereoMirrorMode. However, that doesn't work on platforms with asymmetric viewing frustums (OpenVR) or single-pass stereo yet, but we are working on that.

    The tree billboard atlas solution is going to be in 2017.1
     
  27. LaneFox

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    Cool. I thought I should probably have tested other billboards but was mainly interested in trees. If it works on other billboards then I suppose it is limited to the Tree billboarding. Maybe there is a newer beta version with it fixed and I could retest?

    Either way, thanks for keeping us in the loop.
     
  28. KellyJelly

    KellyJelly

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    Ok, I have confirmed it only works with SpeedTree billboards, which is the only easy way to get a billboard asset/renderer (https://docs.unity3d.com/ScriptReference/BillboardAsset.html) into the engine right now. This will also work with the forthcoming atlas method, as it is similar to what SpeedTree currently does with its billboarded LODs.

    After some investigation, the current behavior with terrain trees is more complicated. The billboards are actually always screen facing, and the perceived orientation comes from the orientation of the prototype mesh. I've attached an image showing the wireframe orientation of some terrain tree billboards. I regret that I incorrectly indicated that the camera facing setting would have an effect on terrain tree billboards.
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Mar 28, 2017
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  29. LaneFox

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    Ah, okay. So the root of the issue is the terrain tree reference mesh orientation being rendered for the billboard. Too bad this feature won't fix what we're seeing but at least we know what the issue is now.

    Think a fix is on the board in the near future? Sounds like we'll need to migrate to Speed Tree where the trees don't have rave-parties in the distance, otherwise.
     
  30. KellyJelly

    KellyJelly

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    Depending on how quickly you need a fix, and how comfortable you are with the technical stuff, you can set up billboard asset/renderers manually. You'll have to render a static image of a tree that you would want to use, and you can use the SpeedTree materials with any billboard asset/renderer, not just ones that come from importing SpeedTree assets.

    If you are able to wait a bit longer, the atlas billboarding method I am working on will solve the perceived motion problem because it basically does what I am suggesting above automatically. It will likely be in the early betas of 2017.1 as a set of C# calls to create atlas textures and billboard assets from tree prefabs. A simpler non-script setting for this technique in the terrain inspector is currently being investigated and may come later.

    Of course, nothing is official until it ships, so I can't promise a timeline for this.
     
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  31. LaneFox

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    Of course, no problem.

    Thanks for the information it has been very helpful!
     
  32. JDMulti

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    Good to see that someone finally picked up this issue. It has been open since 2014 and I thought I would never see someone working on it. However I still think the whole terrain system should be overhauled as it's the worst in it's kind of all game engines I've seen. No seamless terrain height and texture painting, weird billboards in VR, limited grass painting as when you continue painting, all the first grasses disappear. I made some nice terrains but painting by hand is just awefull at the moment. I've send feedback on quality of life improvements (told me to do when I was at Unite 2015 A'dam), but never seen an answer nor improvement else then bug fixes.

    Don't ge me wrong, Unity is a nice tool, but the terrainsystem is just way behind and used to be the worst together with MovieTexture, of which the last is finally being improved. Can't wait for the new terrain system... if it ever comes. :p
     
  33. Gibbonuk

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    This does sound great, also good to have an update. Could you elaborate a little more on how I (or we) could possible make a fix for this untill the release of the beta containing the atlas billboarding method you are implimenting?

    I really want to try and get trees going in my VR (without having to buy speedtree), as they are a significant part of my project.

    I do agree with this, however with perseverance, using certain terrain tools and procedural generation of trees and grass I have found the terrain system to work well for me in creating photo realistic terrains, apart from this VR issue. But admittedly I haven't done any terrain, texturing or veg placement by hand, so cant comment on this.
    I have however done my own modifications to both the grass shader and tree shader to improve them for my needs.

    Thanks
     
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2017
  34. LaneFox

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    For those interested in a temporary fix, use LOD Groups on your tree prefabs and make the lowest one cross quad with the tree texture or a quad with a custom billboard script. Push your Terrain Tree billboard distance all the way up and you'll never see Terrain Billboards.

    Basically, use LOD groups and turn off terrain billboarding.
     
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  35. RibsNGibs

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    I've noticed grass is also oriented to forward direction of camera, not towards camera position. A little vomit-inducing in VR!

    I'm pretty sure I can cook up my own grass asset/material/shader. Is there any way for me to get those into the Unity terrain system, and if not, are there any third party products that are out there that will 1) let me paint them on easily in areas like the unity detail paint brush and 2) do the lod fading out thing for me?

    And I don't have the expertise to cook up my own trees - is there a third party tree asset system (either set to work within Unity terrain or in its own system) that solves the current problem where most of the leaf textures also rotate to match camera orientation instead of position? I don't mind purchasing a terrain package asset but I would like to have verification that it would work without fiddling.
     
  36. rickblacker

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    Do you have any recommended tutorials on how to use LOD groups on tree prefabs? I've got so much to learn.
     
  37. LaneFox

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  38. virror

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  39. vice39

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    Well, it's been over a year, and the trees are still wacky/broken in VR. Good job everyone.
     
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  40. jmitcheson

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    2017.1 out... any information on improvements?
     
  41. jmitcheson

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  42. virror

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  43. rluks

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    I have also encountered this issue. It looks "trippy". It feels strange to be able to rotate trees around you with your head. Totally breaks immersion in VR. What are possible workarounds for this?

    "Billboards face camera position" does nothing (5.5.2f1).
     
  44. clamchoda

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    I've had this thread bookmarked for 1 year, any news?
     
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  45. vice39

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    None.
     
  46. jmitcheson

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    Calm down people, it's not like Unity has much money. Furthermore, this is a VR issue. It's not like Unity is coming out in public and promoting VR development. I think we need to be reasonable.
     
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  47. jmitcheson

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    Also, I mean, trees... have you ever even played a game with trees? One or two trees; maybe. But placing many trees together in a large area in the background?! Now you've lost me. How can we expect such a fringe feature to receive much attention is beyond me.
     
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  48. AndersMalmgren

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    Unity guys come on. We need a working foliage solution in Unity!
     
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  49. NeilC

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    Just adding my name to this list, having just seen the issue in VR with the branch billboards in the free Speedtree Broadleaf...
     
  50. AndersMalmgren

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    And working grass/foliage that does not completely kill perfomance
     
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