Official Unity plan pricing and packaging updates

is this going to be a normal thing? every year the devs are expected to pay more?
https://blog.unity.com/news/pro-enterprise-new-pricing

 

you're right. it is absolutely predicated on being malicious - but the vulnerability here is that being malicious towards the developer brings arbitrary cost levied by Unity. Unity becomes the lever, the liability, that a bad actor can pull on towards a developer... and I'm by no means good at this.

My point is that this business model introduces huge liabilities towards a developer and that it's not well thought through based on this scenario alone.

 

F*** you, Unity. Just F*** you.

 

Doing that to demonstrate piracy should be quite the hoot. Especially if Unity's lawyers approach this as if you are in bad faith and are actively trying to invalidate your numbers. Keep in mind that we are talking installs per user/device, not sales, so your store metrics might not help you here.

 

That's the good thing, they do not and won't have proof, according to them, they are going to just making it up. Based on proprietary "estimates". In other words, total bullshit and they will just bill people arbitrarily.

 

Yet once you cross the threshold it hit's to hard to reliably built a company upon this basis.

Going forward, Indies will be afraid to cross the 200k threshold. It's utterly insane how high the entirety fee starts. Especially for games priced below $5.

 

Then why bother with installs in the first place? Why are you all being such snakes about this?

 

Can anyone clarify what the detailed operation would be like for games that only use ads (Unity Ads)?

 

Oh, thanks! that will be very useful!

 

Unity's operating cost is $2.7 billion while their revenue is $1.4 billion. You understand that a business has to make money to continue existing?

 

This is a massive middle finger to the people who quite literally make your product viable. If you think shareholders and gamers themselves won't take note of this as well, you're sorely mistaken. This reeks of upper management that's completely out of touch with the industry and community insisting on leaving their own mark on a project in spite of the reputational damage to feed their own egos. It's embarrassing.

 

@BenjiM_Unity Please consider just raising the revenue share instead. Wasn't the main goal for the engine to "Make Game Dev Accessible for everyone"? This new runtime fee can pose as a risk to developers if they end up not making money while having a large player base. Revenue share does not pose such a financial risk as there wouldn't be a case where we get a bill shock charging us more than what we are earning from the product. I have not included other fraudulent risk concerns that would come with the runtime fee policy. It's hard enough to develop and maintain a game, please don't make it even harder!

 

WAit, what? In what world, your own Q&A;

You have completely and utterly stated otherwise before. In the topic of WebGL even you have stated that EVERY TIME IT CACHES FRESH it will count as a new install. That means everytime they clear their cache, every browser, every device is a new install. One person alone on WebGL could constitute dozens of installs a week.

So my question. I refuse this new license, I refuse the new contract. I no longer want Unity updates, this will be THE LAST F***ING PROJECT I ever use Unity for unless this changes. I reject the new contract, I want to operate on the old contract and our old licensing as we agreed to and as we PAID FOR.

What now?

 

YOU DONT PAY PER INSTALL IF YOU HAVENT HIT THE REVENUE BENCHMARK.

People think they're free game is going to cost them a fortune.

 

No the spirit of this program is 'give Unity money' for doing nothing! I ask you why does Unity deserve to get this install Tax? What have they done, or will do by Jan 2024? What have they offered me above what I could have got yesterday?

At best you could claim that Unity Plus developers can save $400 p.a because they could drop down to free subscription, though if they want to remove splash screen then they are immediately worse of having to pay for Pro.

This whole premise seems like it missed a step, like Unity had an internal meeting and said right starting in 2024 every new/renewed subscription has to pay 5% royalties on everything. Which then someone pointed out that was awful and instead this convoluted plan was hatched.

Literally the day before this plan comes into effect I have to give Unity NOTHING extra for installs of any game I've made past, present, future. The day this comes into effect I must now pay Unity for installs above subscription thresholds, but Unity gave me nothing in return, no new features, they aren't driving more sales, they have literally just said 'give me money' and worse 'give me money' on all your old projects too if they cross thresholds!

Don't point to new Pro features, I didn't need them before, and don't need them now, I was happy on Plus, which you have also taken away.

I'm sorry for being so forthright here, but it just boggles my mind that Unity seem to think they are doing me a favour by telling me to give them money for having users install my games ( beyond threshold, blah, blah, etc ).

 

"Unfortunately, it's not possible for Unity's system to know it's an initial installation or not."

So device with HWID at a location and through a distributor downloaded a game at 9:30pm. You save that information in a database.

It (the same device with the same HWID at the same location) then downloads it again three days later after resetting its OS and deleting the original install. You save that data in a database. You then do your coding magic and BAM you know which of the two was the first install. Date and time exists people. Databases exist. You can access hardware information from a program (a game). I don't know why so many people think they can't track the downloads. THAT's trivial. The rest of the stuff you mentioned is HARD bro wym hahaha. Still you aren't wrong though. This current model does leave room for exploitation via spoofing HWID and we will need answers on that.

You goobers need to stop spreading misinformation about the installation tracking being impossible though. Idk where that idea is coming from I'm seeing it pop up a good bit and it's just straight wrong.

 

How can you make that differentiation?
You'd either need to have personal identifying information on Unity's side for every single end-user, or you'd have to store something locally, at which point installing on a newly formatted Computer cannot be differenated from installing for the first time, at which point, the concern about Install Bombing is legitimate.

 

If you've made 200K and you have the option to make 950K instead of the 1 mil you would have made, I think its an easy call.

 

the spirit of unity has always been "no royalties" but what do i know?

 

You don't even have to do the math, it's not legal. Imagine if YouTube said that from now on, creators will have to pay $1 for each new view once they reach 100,000 views. Fees can only be based on revenue, not per installation.

 

COPPA? GDRP? Multiple devices?

 

https://www.axios.com/2023/09/13/unity-runtime-fee-policy-marc-whitten

Note this part:

> As for Game Pass and other subscription services, Whitten said that developers like Aggro Crab would not be on the hook, as the fees are charged to distributors, which in the Game Pass example would be Microsoft.

So not only did they piss off developers, but *distributers* are going to start weighing in too...

 

I don't believe anyone here questions that Unity is a business and not a charity. However, this move won't help them, it will only make things worse for them and also for us. Nobody wins and its profoundly obtuse if they pursue it, instead of exploring other routes.

 

Was it? I read before on this thread that reinstalling was considered as another install. Plus installing on separate devices still seems to count as another install (or download? it's complicated...)
I can't believe this desire being true (at least not for Unity as a company) as for hours nobody either on Twitter or here was able to specify what an install exactly is to know when the fee is generated.

 

BUT YOU PAY PER INSTALL ONCE YOU HAVE.

This means WebGL demos, this means demos, this means F***ing PIRATED COPIES. If you are a free to play game you could end up easily with a 10mil downloads and maybe $200-250k and actually end up owing Unity more than you made.

My small project makes 200k and we have over a million downloads. We haven't even hit steam yet.

 

1. Verification of Unique Installs: How will Unity accurately differentiate between unique and repeat installations? What technologies or methodologies will be employed to ensure that developers are not unfairly charged for non-unique installations?
   
   
2. Piracy Detection: How will Unity identify and distinguish between legitimate downloads and pirated copies? This is crucial, as developers should not be financially penalized for pirated installations.
   
   
3. Protection Against Bot Attacks: What mechanisms are in place to detect and prevent automated bots from inflating download numbers? Specifically, how will Unity handle scenarios where bots are programmed to generate unique device IDs and cycle through installs and uninstalls using virtual machines?
   
   
4. Competitive Sabotage: How does Unity plan to address the potential for malicious competitors to artificially inflate download counts, thereby increasing costs for the targeted developers?
   
   
5. Device ID Validity: Even if Unity uses device IDs to track unique installations, how will it ascertain the authenticity of these IDs? It's not uncommon for emulators or other software to generate fake but unique device IDs.
   
   
6. Multiple Devices Per User: How will the system account for users who install the same application on multiple devices? Will each installation be treated as unique, and if so, isn't this unfair to developers?
   
   
7. Regional Considerations: How will Unity accommodate for regional differences in download behavior? In some markets, it's common for users to uninstall and reinstall applications due to limited device storage.
   
   
8. Transparency: What level of transparency will Unity offer in terms of reporting? Developers need detailed insights into how and why they are being charged to make informed business decisions.
   
   
9. Cost Predictability: With the proposed model, how can developers reliably predict their operational costs, given that they can fluctuate based on factors largely out of their control?
   
   
10. Appeal Mechanism: Will there be a procedure in place for developers to dispute charges they believe to be unjust? What would this process entail?
    
    
11. Data Privacy and Legal Compliance: How does Unity plan to manage the collection of user data in a way that is compliant with global data privacy laws, such as GDPR in Europe, CCPA in California, or any other regional legislation?
    
    
12. Country-Specific Data Tracking: Different countries have different laws regarding the tracking of device IDs, Google accounts, and other personal identifiers. How will Unity adapt its tracking methodology to be compliant with these varying regulations?
    
    
13. User Consent: Will users be notified and asked for their consent before their device IDs or other identifiers are used for tracking downloads? What steps will Unity take to ensure informed consent?
    
    
14. Liability: If a developer is found to be in violation of data privacy laws due to Unity's tracking methods, who will bear the legal responsibility?
    
    
15. Auditability: Will developers have the option to audit the data collection and billing process to ensure accuracy and legal compliance?
    

 

People will be actively doing this just to spite Unity (and let's not pretend the gaming community isn't looking for ways to hurt developers with review bombs, death threats, etc. They're not a majority but they exist.) I'd give it 24 hours before the first case of this is reported. Once someone configures a docker image it'll be as simple as edgy 13 year olds opening command line and typing "docker build -t leethax . && docker run leethax"

But Unreal offers a clear pricing structure that doesn't rely on nebulous numbers that are out of a developer's control.
Literally out of our control. What happens if we take the game off sale? Steam purchasers will still be able to download the game.

Yeah I'm very curious about how this is going to play out. Though not much more I can say on it as it'd all be speculation.
Curious what methods they'll have to determine what you're earning, or how they find it out from opaque sources.

I'm very worried about this, because for some of us here the potential for a developer to lose their house paying for legal fees they can't afford is a reality we are facing.

 

You understand that Unitys customers are also businesses that have to make money to continue existing?

You also understand that Unity has competitors, and so can't milk devs with no consequences?

 

WHAT THE F*CK ARE THEY SPENDING THEIR MONEY ON? IT SURE AS SH*T ISN'T COMPETENT DEVELOPMENT ON THEIR ENGINE.

Why does the hard working Unity developer have to foot the bill for their rampant mismanagement?

 

In that case they must reduce operating cost. They are very ineffective and spending money for useless things.

 

This is a bad choice.

 

Dude this isn't about the money, it's about how they want to get it. The install fee is the most scummy and stupid thing I have ever heard of.

 

In 1994 I intensively studied Basic on ZX Spectrum, and when I studied everything, it died.
In 1997, I intensively studied Pascal and assembler to make games for MS DOS, and when I studied everything, it died.
2001 I tried to make games for Windows using Delphi and Delphi X, for direct X, but it turned into infinity.
2009 I became interested in the possibility of making flash games and began to actively study it. By 2012, I mastered flash and action scripting perfectly, it died.
2015 I became interested in the Unity engine and began to actively study it.
2019 I managed to release a good game.
2023 again? I'm tired of this.

I'm just a solo indie developer.

 

They literally said here in this thread they have no current way of tracking it, so they're flat out said they're just going to lie to you with how many they think is being installed.

 

I agree this is going to destroy extremely low profit free to play games. Which is also unity's main user base. It wont have a big impact on more traditional games (i.e. steam)

 

Anyone that trusts Unity to act in developers' interests at this point is out of their mind lmao. There's nothing Unity can do to make 100% sure developers aren't getting dinged for malicious installs. Oh wait, except not charging "runtime fees" in the first place. Even if the installs counted were only genuine and unique, this is still a S*** model.

 

Our Studio will be moving to a different engine unless a full reversal is made. This model discourages growth.

0.20c now may be 0.50c in the future.
200,000 now may be 100,000 in the future.

We already pay thousands of dollars a year to LICENSE the Engine

 

Then implement a royalty based system on unit sales rather than installs. There is no surprises or guess work with unit sales.

 

I think it's very stupid

 

Too late - I already tried it as an exercise for illustration purposes (and I will NEVER use it or share it. EVER, because I'm not a chucklehead)

 

even if they step back from this BS i can not find anything to justify the increase in the licence, maybe the new input system (note that i'm an indie) but even that is not exactly important, i can live without it, but nothing more, there is nothing that make me staym i'm working on an android game and yes i have some work done and for my future projects i'm working with Unigine, but now what can unity offer me so i do not change the engine?
Do you guys knows something? any feature?

 

So the market will decide.

I'm not really upset that Hearthstone is going to have share some of their $400,000,000 dollars in revenue with Unity.

 

I’m not opposed to them turning a profit; they should be able and allowed to.

What I am opposed to is this pricing scheme. Rev share, or some other derivative, but this is not it.

 

I started 10 years before you, I'm still optimistic, embrace the change, ___kiddo___! (sorry, I had to). Good luck!

 

Anyone in America? I request a class action lawsuit against Unity.

 

even if they walk back on this update, it's a certainty that they'd try something else equally scummy in the future.

 

They already stated they will still be charging for multiple device downloads from a single user. Are you suggesting they don't know how to track multiple devices correctly? because that's what I was talking about. What are you getting at with this? Also for the other stuff - I'm not a lawyer so idk. Sorry bro... Little bit confused with your reply tbh.

 

LOL. As far as I can tell for my client work I can most likely drop down to free subscription, suffer the splash screen and save money. Alternatively if the numbers don't add up for my clients, I lose projects, no projects, no point in using Unity. In both cases Unity will literally not make a single dollar from me using their product and in the latter I abandon Unity and the forums and 12 years of experience and helping people.

How does that help indie dev's?

If they have to increase revenue, increase subscription costs, offer better services that developers want to use, features that work, not some stupid convoluted system. A system that is open to abuse and for which you have to fully trust Unity will

• Not change the fees/rates/tiers next year.
• Magically know exactly how many installs and not reinstalls, pirating etc
• Be respectful in disputes ( asset store has been a poor example of this already )
• Not change the rules, retroactively and unilaterally - as apparently they can and have done.

 

What do you mean? they're pumping and dumping the latest trends. First it was the metaverse, then NFTs, now its generative AI.

While they are horribly mismanaged (just look at glass door reviews) some of their engineers are doing good work.

ECS + .NET Migration are pretty much the only good things happening at Unity right now.

 

Well the answer here is but pro and only be up for 2K or whatever it is.