Official Unity plan pricing and packaging updates

Yes, when you ask God for a dream, you should ask this.

"Oh God, please make my game is a smash hit.
but please don't exceed the thresholds in Unity."

 

https://forum.unity.com/threads/uni...ckaging-updates.1482750/page-130#post-9313595

 

Oh I bet the revenue forecast chart on that google sheet slide was orgasmic. No wonder they’re rolling the dice.

Shame they rolled a 1

 

It's of course reasonable that Unity gets a share if a game based on it is doing well financially, but number of copies sold and especially installs isn't a valid basis for calculating this.
An expensive game will both have a much longer way up to 200 000 installs, and if the fixed fee kicks in won't be a small part of the profits.
A cheap game will reach the threshold much faster and the fixed fee can potentially consume the entire profit.
It must be better for all parties in this if Unitys share is based on profit alone. More accurate, predictable, fair and less risk.
Can someone from Unity please confirm I've understood the policy change correctly, or tell me what I might be wrong about.

 

Bottomline is Unity needs money and You have to pay for it. So either this idea tehy introduce now...or somethnig else. there is no way back to the old ways

 

Again, I need an immediate answer for this please, Unity team. This change is directly threatening my business if it goes through unchanged and you're just ignoring it like that little insignificant edge case is no big deal.

 

Eric5h5, who said was done with Unity yesterday, removed his profile picture in the forums

 

Call @eizenhorn
His words are even more trustworthy than the official announcement from Unity.

 

And even then there is confusion. What counts as Current year version? 2023 isn't due out until almost 2025!

 

If this is the best answer we're ever going to get about how the tracking works (because you can't actually tell us), then I don't see how you're ever going to be able to dilute any of the concerns developers are having with this. People might be getting confused about the specific calculations regarding the fees, sure, but we are not at all confused about how difficult it is to accurately track installs especially given all the caveats and special cases that we're left to presume are magically determined, or perhaps worse handled through online forms, requests and email chains adding a ton of unnecessary overhead for everyone involved, and consequently leading to some sort of 'pay now, maybe get it sorted much later' paradigm.

 

https://articles.sequoiacap.com/2018-08-29-john-riccitiello



Time to walk the talk, John.

 

The tablet fee https://blog.unity.com/news/plan-pricing-and-packaging-updates says "New installs PER MONTH" (it's above the 1-100k table). So I assume you will pay .15$ each month if each month you have 1-100k installs, it's not cumulative from past months or lifetime, it resets each month. So February you have 100k installs you pay .15, march you have 100k more, you pay .15 again. If there is clarification from Unity about this, share me the link.

 

Let's make a ridiculously pricy game that only allows 200k installs worldwide by kicking up a remote counter every time the game gets installed, artificial scarcity, collector's stuff. I can picture devices with the game installed being auctioned on eBay.

Profit!

 

I'm just catching up on the past several pages of this thread and I've gotta say it was very obvious from all of your posts from early on through now you didn't actually understand the fees. Now you're just trying to pretend you did instead of just admitting you were incorrect. It's fine, it's not worded well and I've explained it many times over the past couple of days.

You pointing out the order of magnitude error in that ridiculous calculator instead of pointing out that it makes no sense in it's entirety is proof enough. Installs are counted monthly and the tiers for Pro and Enterprise only make sense if this is accounted for, there is no calculator that can take a single "Lifetime installs" number and give any sort of accurate result.

You could have a calculator that took "Installs over threshold" and evenly distributed them across 12 months of the year and give some semi-decent answer, but that thing doesn't do that. In fact it doesn't even get the most basic calculation correct:


This is a nonsense answer. Obviously 100,001 installs over the threshold is going to be almost definitely 100,001 * $0.15 ($15,000.15) and "best" case 100,000 * $ 0.15 + 1 * $0.075 ($15,000.075) if all those 100,001 were in 1 month.

I implore people to stop using this calculator entirely.

I only wanted to reply to you because you entered this thread in an abrasive manor and acted like you had all the answers and knowledge. You don't or at least, you didn't. Maybe you do now. Maybe it doesn't affect your stance on the matter, but before you start trying to shout down people with your calculations and theories on the install fees you should make sure they are correct because they weren't.

 

We REQUIRE concrete evidence of your ability to accurately track/discriminate installations. At the moment, it remains merely a wish rather than a substantiated claim. Given the ongoing modifications, how can we have confidence that these conditions will not be altered in the future?

 

Or maybe, 'Dear God please let my game sell millions of copies and then never be installed or played by anyone!'

 

Hell you might have just come up with the first legit use for blockchain-based games!

 

just make a system in your game that shuts down internet on the player's PC for the duration of the game. and install a trojan to be sure unity's process are killed beore they can send the data to the servers

 

This is tragic. Throughout my many years learning Unity, searching about bugs etc, I would always find his posts. He was an asset to the entire community and will be missed.

 

it doesn't work like this.

the entire slight of had of this new system is to force a license agreement change for exiting developers with games already on the market.

If they would had said, all games from September 1 2024 are under this new license, no one would had cared. Because you have time to chose to be in or out. It would suck big time if you loved unity but if the conditions are not good you move somewhere else.

but forcing a lifetime install number, makes it retroactive, meaning that games that are 10 years old, and still on market may trigger this fee. which is what they want!

Unity is seeing this enormous pool of games from where they can potentially milk billions and billions.

What I'm seeing is developers that already spent the money and have either enough revenue to survive and try to get a new game on the market or they are already bankrupt.

Unity, man, the gold coins you believe you are seeing are pieces of coal. There is no money. Is gone. Because of the economic situation we are in. there was this pandemic and probably will be back this winter (if you believe is true or not it doesn't matter). The war, there is a war going on can't do nothing about that either. Europe is bankrupt, US is bankrupt, China is bankrupt, your "emerging markets" are not "trained" to pay money for superfluous products like videogames when they can pirate games just fine. Google, Apple and Microsoft do not like your add spyware because they have their own add spyware.

It suck but maybe fire everyone that is superfluous in the company, hire back the people that can work on the engine, get rid of everyone else. Provide a product that developers want, ask for a decent fee that is appropriate for the quality of the product. Live another day.

 

Don’t worry man, senior software developer over there has seen the tech before and knows how to stop the cat and mouse game between devs and hackers.

 

You don't understand the real meaning of this computer, it is only symbolic of protest.

The truth that makes people angry is:
1. How to calculate fees based on the number of installs, and it is not transparent, an unquantifiable number invented by Unity.
2. Destroy TOS and force all released games to pay new fees.
3. Destroying everyone's jobs, putting many people at risk of bankruptcy and losing their jobs, this is very cruel.

 

Better: 'Dear God please let my game sell millions of copies and then only be installed or played after 12 months!' (NOTE: Don't forget to delist your game after selling millions of copies!)

It is a happy ending for everyone!

 

Tbh Piracy is non issue, just keep updating your game regularly and pirated ones will be out of date.

 

Even if they walk back to something more reasonable it doesn't matter, doing it retroactively is the problem, everyone who has released anything with Unity at any point is now hostage to the whims of whatever policy they think next. That is not how business is done. I can't buy a thing and then years later get an additional invoice telling me "well, actually we want more money now".

 

Legally Unity has no recourse for this, despite what the Unity "lawyers" say. If someone refuses to pay these new fees on an already released game they are not bound by these terms. The worst Unity can do is lock their account.

 

How is that reasonable?
Do you think it would be reasonable when say, Microsoft decides that for every book written in Word a 20ct flat fee must be paid to MS?
You think it reasonable every time a movie is shown or watched Arri gets a 20ct flat fee for every movie shot with their camera?

etc. etc.

 

You really shouldn't do that because for the thousandth times: there will be no tracking installs, they will guess how many times your game was installed the given month. Statistical analysis, not tracking actual installation. They will pull the data out of their ass.

 

Unity please make your new decisions with more clarity when you announce something like this! I'm seeing an upward trend in Godot and Unreal users taking the dump on Unity and using the rage to lure others into using another game engine. I fear this could even affect me as an asset publisher and just drag things down more.

 

@MattCarr you agree on me in this method? I feel pretty sure its correct, but Unity is not confirming much and you seem to be a man having done your own math as well.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1VUeUshho03braI7rx02X_C6osU6QwmuiTfQ77QLlS3w/edit?usp=sharing

 

I think all versions of the game would count. Otherwise I could up my version and distribute the old one to avoid the fee

 

Important question: may switching to another subscription tier endanger our rights?

I mean, if we switch, for example, from Plus to Personal or to Pro aren't we 'accepting' a new ToS?

 

interesting, so following your plan you wait just before the crazy fee could show up and switch to a pro plan to send to postpone the fee to a later date.

even if this "retroactive license change in you favor" condition could be true, which I don't believe it is, how you will know when the fee will trigger?

you don't know what are the numbers unity has behind scenes. Maybe they think your revenue is zero when you get $500k a month. or maybe they think you have $1million/month revenue when you actually have $100/month.

The "I will wait for the last moment" plan will not work because the "you need to pay $160k" condition can trigger at any moment.

 

@LeonhardP @Tautvydas-Zilys I really need an answer to this. This change will cost my business more than we make each month. What am I supposed to do??????????

 

Yes they say even similar versions of the same game count. If they decide that it is the same game under a different name.

 

Choose another engine.

 

updating will trigger more and more install fees from unity.

 

stop licking their ass bro

 

You know that when ever you update the game, pirates will not create updater, they will just delete old version of game, redownload version with new patch and only unity knows if this would result in additional install, and given their's greed, they will count this to their install fee because F*** you, you need to prove that pirate did this.

 

Yes, that seems accurate as it is at this moment. You're separating emerging market installs out into their own section and you're accounting for the other installs amounts separately per month properly.

 

That's good idea.


It really got on my nerves regarding WebGL, where they wrote about how they would charge for WebGL, which doesn't make sense because it CANNOT BE TRACKED, and in reality, every refresh would be charged $0.20. So, this rule is driving companies into ruin.

They changed to, "No, we won't do that." Imagine how uncertain Unity has become as a company, and how people should no longer develop games in Unity because they are not sure if Unity will come up with another absurd idea in a few years that will cost them their business.

A clear example is this WebGL situation. Companies working on WebGL were literally destroyed by this policy, and now it's "okay," they just change their stance as they wish.

UNACCEPTABLE!

You literally can't plan large projects without the fear that all the money and time you've invested will be destroyed in a matter of seconds because Unity will come up with another silly law.

This constant rule-changing just goes to show how UNITY HAS NO IDEA WHAT IT'S DOING. How can you make a plan about this, only for it to be changed just a FEW HOURS LATER?

BEFORE:


AFTER:

 

I have been working on a project for about 2 years now, and I have used unity for a while. What were you guys thinking, this is making me question whether I should use unity or not. Price per install is so dumb, like have you sat down and thought about it? Do you not see how people can get screwed over from reinstalls, trolls that would use the loop holes to ruin developers lives, piracy adding to the count of installs. You say there's security measures to prevent that stuff but I highly doubt it will solve the problem, I mean you can see bloody Triple A games cracked in a matter of days, you think you have the god version program of preventing things such as piracy and trolls?

If your system fails, It will hurt developers when they see they have to pay for the per installs because these people pirated it or simply reinstalled multiple times whether maliciously or not. Stop putting idiots in charge...

All this time wasted, all my experience, all the investment I made with my purchases for assets looks like will be going down the f*cking drain.

 

It’s more complex than that. Many users stay with old versions for any random reason. Driving simulators with mods are a good example. 15 out of 10 friends I know play old pirated versions of OMSI and ETS. If OMSI was made in Unity they would have 95% or more of pirate installs to pay the install fee.

 

Just to set a point clear:



https://ibb.co/rGN3t8C

This, is truly the **BIGGEST LIE** Unity can do.

Imagine following:

Think about: you are going to HumbleBundle, for Example. And HB tell you: we need 1000 Steam Codes from you.
okay
now, you go steam, and collect 1000 Keys, and give this to HB.
HB is now selling this codes, for example: like MMOGA or other.
in return
the Costumer comes back to steam, and aktivate your legal Key, in his Selling Pack, for Steam.
you got an 1:1 complete legal steam Sale
steam himself, is not interested in, from what Place this code is coming, it is your Game code.
and
there is :
No List
no statistic
no difference
to any other Steam Sale in this case.
it is just : a typically code, set your Game free
and unity want to tell us, they know the Difference between a Steam Key, and a Steam Sale, and they know, that this steam key, what is just a steam kay, is coming from Humble Bundle or a Collection sale ?

this is such a big Lie, this is .... not to believe


the most audacious thing of all is that they do NOT EVEN SAY EXCUSE
and with such lies, still defend their model.
For this one lacks the words.
Still I point to it: In the "We help you" - yes, we see that! Just as, for example, asset sellers, if you want to return an asset, tell you: "no you can not, you have to Unity Support" and he tells you that there is an answer after 3 weeks waiting time.
and with that you are alone.
Ergo: that is a huge help you can expect from Unity.
Likewise, I still see no possibility of separation between pirated copy and original. Where should that come from?
Their model is unacceptable. And after all the S*** storm, they don't even have the decency to say "sorry".
No, they are still telling lies to justify their model.
This must be a nightmare.
This is so far away from any reality that it smokes.
and - THEM - should I then believe that they would "only" count the new installation? Where do I actually see the number of installs huh ?
What is n with gesellten keys, or eg must then the portal like Steam or Gog or Humble Bundle for the book, how many have installed where and when ?
and I myself, am dependent on what others tell me, and have 0 Durchblick about my own API or metric ?
... that's what they want to sell us ?
it is .... unimaginable brazen!

 

...and those updates... there's absolutely zero chance they'll ever be considered -installs-, right? I mean, that'll be guaranteed because it'll be in the TOS, right? Right?

Right?

 

Impossible for this game. Managing and updating it is a full-time job for all team members already. We have zero capacity left over to reimplement anything or even begin to learn other engines.

 

I am on the same idea because is logic that retroactive change of terms makes no sense because how could you have known?

But there is this trend in various countries to try and push this idea of retroactive laws.

 

You say you will be going bankrupt if you don't, so I don't see any much of a choice, really.

 

all of you guys praising Unreal like they are any better, wtf? its all the same corpo boat, we need an independent solution, pay the engine what it needs to sustain and progress for the good of everyone, not some mfs for profit