Official Unity plan pricing and packaging updates

The sum alone ist enough to understand nobody will give the slightest S*** about the criticism here.

 

Imagine $421M spent on software engineers instead:

A) Better game engine
B) no charge by install
C) no adware company acquisition.

It would be horrible!

Thank god for John R!

 

this is still wrong, f2p and freemium games have high number of installs , and they doesnt generate the amount fo revenue needed to cover the cost if we go per install base, either add a revenue cap, or add an option to op in to a rev share method, also add a clause that will protect the price of the per install, and the threshold for when the game is realsed, so we cna be sure once the game is released one morning we will not wake up and all the install fees are up 3 -5 times more than the day before.

 

I usually don't post here, but I'd like to provide some real life numbers:

I mean one of my apps has 132K installs a month and 3.94 million lifetime installs
So in theory, if my app made more than 200k in a year, I would have to pay roughly 26000 in fees per month, due to the install volume. And anyone who knows anything about freemium or ad based games / apps, knows that 132K installs doesn't even get close to making up for the fee. This essentially means, once I reach the 200K, that I'd forced to upgrade to pro, or be bankrupted. I don't expect this to scale much better at higher revenue either.

I would also like to point out that if their data model is off and they tell you your install numbers are much higher than they really are, one of your only recourses would be to share your real installation numbers with Unity, which again... not much of a point.

I used Unity for the past 10 years and have been a paying customers for all of those years, assuming I wouldnt RETROACTIVELY charged for projects I made under a completely different license without a say.

Just adding my voice to the chorus of developers that are leaving the engine. I am not going to enjoy learning how to port my apps to native code or another engine, but it's not like I have a choice when you are threatening my livelihood.

 

They won't. They will run through an AI random generator and it will decide if you have enough revenue or not. If the AI doesn't like you, you'll be accused that you do and good luck proving otherwise.

 

Charging per install feels invasive. Where is the good will at?

 

Imagine if Photoshop started trying to charge by the document.

Imagine if they said, hey, Photoshop documents are being used to make Unity hundreds of millions of dollars, but all we get from them is $30 per user. We should be able to get a piece of that pie!

 

Tbh this was my first feel for what was happening, but the fact this actually could run afoul of California's 9th circuit even with walkbacks... the fact this shakes developer confidence in the TOS/EULA and we will actually be leaving Unity for GoDot or Unreal. I think they actually thought developers would just roll over and accept this.

I think that, they honestly, didn't consider that the original wordage meant that successful indie games that were iusing WebGL, Demos, Early Access, Crowdfunding, would end up owing their houses to Unity due to the install fee being tracked on EVERY install. I think whoever made this push (likely Riccitiello) are so damn ignorant and baffling uninformed that he couldn't consider that, and for some reason the board didn't correct it? Or maybe they COULDN'T correct him which means Unity has an ineffective board that fails to reign in an incompetent CEO.

That's super dangerous to us as developers. A board should be able to correct incompetent CEOs, and a CEO should not be incompetent. Riccitiello did ACTUAL damage to EA, he harmed EA, he made the situation worse there. Why Unity chose him I don't understand, CEOs are in short supply but jfc with how bad a job he did in general and the fact EA had to dig itself out of the hole he left for them, surely there were OTHER options.

 

May I know where revenue is based on? I only have ads on my app.

 

Any % speedrun to lose all developers

 

I'm not even in my right mind. I'm not even going to continue my current project in Unity as it's been too much of a headache as it is. As we type I am installing Unreal. Been putting it off for far too long.

 

I understand that Unity wants a cut of the cake from games built on their engine that are successful.

But doing it with installs is trying to get a cut from a cake that doesn't even exist, because devs are not making any money from installs, they make money from sales. So why in god's name don't they just do revenue share?

 

This is a huge issue. First the wording here you have used says you don't "want" to charge, it doesn't say you "wont charge" for fraudulent installs.

Also how can you possibly determine a pirated install vs a legit install, you aren't even tracking user information so it's simply not possible? What is to stop indie devs getting a massive bill from Unity because their game was pirated at a 10:1 ratio? And what happens when they do? They have to pay a bill they can't afford, and somehow prove the number of pirated installs and trust that Unity will accept that? This aspect is a HUGE issue.

It's not even so much the per-install fee for legitimate installs that is the problem. It's the unknown costs from all of the other installs. For non free to play games instead of per-install they should have just done per-sale.

 

My biggest problem with Unigine is that the most interesting stuff are in the SIM category and last I checked it was $6k or something. And this was before the pandemic and the giga-inflation. Now everything is "contact us" which doesn't give much confidence that it got better.

 

May I know where the revenue will be based on? My app is free and only running on unity ads. My app already have 1M+ installs, but I am only have 100-200 USD revenue on ads per month.

 

So did that evil CEO stepped down already?

 

Oh nice, it's a one-time fee and its not ongoing! We're just getting charged one-time, multiple times, whenever someone installs, forever! Wow.

I'm not sure you understand what "one-time" and "ongoing" mean. Do you think revenue share models charge you for the same purchase every month in perpetuity or something? I have no idea what you're saying anymore.

 

I think that is the main issue, that Unity went from a way to make games to a way to go to jail for massive debt if sell well.

Who would use Unity with such a possibility present ?

 

Actually, they are still saying the same thing. Or. better phrasing it: the changed version does not deny the first statement, in fact, re-emphasizing it with different words. It's just a word play.

 

you shoudl be fine as long as you dotn pass 200k revenue, after that you can upgrade to unity pro and the revenue needs to be above 1mil usd for the install fee after which every install on new device will cost you money, if i understood what is being said here correctly

 

This is a great demonstration of the company's structure.

It looks like Unity developers, the people who actually write the Unity Engine, don't matter anymore. They wasn't even asked about possibility and complexity of implementing such solution, before making this very decision. Now I see this company as just one big Business Development dep and all others for them just “serving personel”.

 

No, it's actually very high. We see this now in DDoS attacks on even small games, key phishing attacks, and people literally re-routing purchases to try and make it so game companies OWE money to distribution services using Forex. This is stuff that happens right now.

Unity has given these malicious actors the literal easiest way to handle this, the same networks used for DDoS could be quickly and painlessly repurposed into purchase/install reinstall botnets... this would take maybe a day.

Unity has in several interviews said they cannot track individuals and the onus is on game developers to prove fraud. Though their wording has softened that they will "work with game developers who suspect fraud," the onus is still on us. Unity lacks the ability to collect accurate data on who is or is not legitimate, what is a first install, and what is a "fresh" install (clean your registry and it's a fresh install btw (Virtual machines)) and as we don't have data to PROVE what is legitimate or not. Unity doesn't have that data... and Unity seems to want to establish a hostile relationship with us game developers.

They're probably going to rule against us in general. We can't prove fraud, it's against their new CEO's policies and interests of money farming to side with us... how do you imagine this will play out for us?

 

They gave two completely different answers. One says yes the other says no. This is not a phrasing issue.

 

Does this mean that the store fronts managed by Valve, Epic, Microsoft, Sony, Nintendo, Alphabet, Apple, and CD PROJEKT will be the ones billed for each install performed from their store front distribution installer?

If so, why does all of the other questions suggest the developers are the ones billed?
If not, can you update the FAQ to clarify what a distributor is defined as?

 

I agree with this sentiment. I believe Unity has a different definition of recurring than we do.

BUT DONT LOSE SITE OF THE REAL ISSUE!

charging anything per install is flat out egregious and wrong!!!

 

I'm not a lawyer, but I know enough about the very basics of law to know that California law does not supersede all laws of all other countries and zones a product is sold in. The retroactive TOS changes will not hold up in court. Its frankly unbelievable that you think legally, this is the case.

Unless their are big changes to this policy, there will be a MASS exodus of released titles from Steams and mobile app stores. Like, at a previously unheralded level never before seen on the planet. 10,000s of games will be pulled, and your market standing crippled forever.

I know profits make the decisions so know that it would be highly more profitable to reverse course on this install policy. It just wasn't really thought through, this is obvious to everyone.

I swear its like the C-levels are secretly shorting the stock. Because this is just such a poorly conceived idea, that seems to have not really been fully considered, and has already severely tarnished Unity Tech's reputation.

Change course, before nothing is left to be saved.

This won't even effect me personally, I'm a indie solo dev working on his first major release, and unlikely to break 200k. I'll finish this game, and that'll be it for me at Unity probably... But... nonetheless just pains me to see such a great engine destroy itself with a single policy change like this.

 

Jesus, I'm usually the one warning for defensive software and even I was so shocked that I didn't consider this avenue. Want a competitor out of the picture? Just levy some bots to mass install their game! Easier than ever with the kinds of automation we have come up with in the last year or so.

 

Yeah the fact this risk is there, we can't afford to risk Unity in our future.

 

They can't answer that because they posted this while drunk and they hadn't finished transitioning it from one earlier overreaching draft version to the equally terrible draft version they posted. They know they can't charge the storefronts for these new costs they vomited into the developer's TOS that those storefronts never agreed to, but they're so befuddled by their own ineptitude that they haven't been able to resolve the inaccuracies in their trash statements and FAQs.

 

Hello, is this fee per game or per unity user?

Is it possible to release a game in 200,000 increments? the first group gets version 1, the second group gets version 2, etc?

 

Unity have said demos don't count as installs. You are misinterpreting everything, ignoring updated information, and repeating misconceptions.

 

Keep in mind this is exactly the sort of thing this CEO was salivating over before.

Back when he mentioned the idea of players needing to pay to refill their ammo clip in Battlefield when they've already sunk in quite a few hours and become less price sensitive.

Which is just a way to reframe being scummy, getting people to invest time and effort into something and then trying to extort them later when it's harder to say no.

This seems right in line. Until this CEO is out of this company I think Unity is a major risk.

 

Thank you for answering.

So they will base it on the unity ads revenue? I am worried that they will assume that the app is a paid app even though it is free.

 

Yeah I actually made this exact argument a few minutes ago.

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/gamedev/comments/16i36k9/i_think_this_article_sums_up_the_current_disaster/

 

The cocaine they are likely doing to keep their energy levels up while they figure out how to respond probably ain't helping either.

 

How do they tell a run time installed is from a demo or a paid game ? Is exactly same run time, so would not be possible by default.

I just hope i wont get a bill for the test builds i do for my internal work.

 

Anyone wondering how will Unity check for the installations, this comment on the Ars Technica article explains it very well:

 

Do not worry, Unity billing you is not related to actual revenue you have or actual downloads or installs. So your Unity Income Tax (UNIT) isn't related to your actual income.

 

Damn if only Unity would actually give clear information instead of figuring out ways to nickel and dime its developers

 

Because this is designed to target F2P games. That's why for most devs this change doesn't cost anything. It seems (this is my guess based on what info I have seen, not something I can verify) that Unity felt F2P games using their engine were not paying them enough despite earning millions.

If you look at how this actually works, it's only really F2P games that are affected. Only the largest non-F2P games would ever end up paying these fees, and even then it would end up being a very small fraction of earnings.

 

because they just write whatever the f they want. its a fin mess. do not trust them anymore, they change the rules in their TOS randomly. nothing they write makes sense. you need to be a lawyer to start using their engine and also you need to have funds to be able to enforce those contracts with them

 

Damn, so now all games will be essentially malware.

It just gets better and better.

 

I just saved that image - can't delete it from our hard drives, until new terms says so (?) lol

 

I don't see Unity existing after this. Many developers, me included, are leaving this engine. Enterprises that are heavily invested in the software are going to sue and they have a good case.

No company in their right mind would do something like this. This was a self-inflicted wound done on purpose by parasites that infiltrated Unity's cabinets.

 

I agree, but this goes both ways. The number of made-up scenarios that completely misinterpret how this works from panicked devs who think they lose money when they sell more games is getting ridiculous.

As awful as some aspects of this may be, anyone who isn't an F2P dev is not going to lose out by selling more games.

 

Worse yet you can have a certain chatbot write all of the code for you so you don't even need to know how.

Spoiler: Example

Certainly! Below is a sample PowerShell script that demonstrates how to automatically install and uninstall an application on Windows 11. In this example, I'll use 7-Zip as the application to install and uninstall.

First, download the installer file for the application and place it in a location you can easily reference (e.g., C:\Downloads\7z1900-x64.exe).

The script will perform the following tasks:

• Install the 7-Zip application using its installer.
• Uninstall the 7-Zip application.

Here's the PowerShell script:

Code (csharp):

1. # This PowerShell script automatically installs and then uninstalls 7-Zip on Windows 11.
2. # Function to Install 7-Zip
3. function Install-7Zip {
4.     $installerPath = "C:\Downloads\7z1900-x64.exe" # Update this path to where you've downloaded the installer
5.     Write-Host "Installing 7-Zip..."
6.     Start-Process $installerPath -ArgumentList "/S" -Wait
7.     Write-Host "7-Zip Installed."
8. }
9. # Function to Uninstall 7-Zip
10. function Uninstall-7Zip {
11.     Write-Host "Uninstalling 7-Zip..."
12.     $uninstallString = (Get-WmiObject -Class Win32_Product -Filter "Name='7-Zip 19.00 (x64 edition)'").UninstallString
13.     Start-Process "cmd.exe" -ArgumentList "/c $uninstallString /S" -Wait
14.     Write-Host "7-Zip Uninstalled."
15. }
16. # Install 7-Zip
17. Install-7Zip
18. # Wait for 10 seconds before uninstalling (for demonstration purposes)
19. Start-Sleep -Seconds 10
20. # Uninstall 7-Zip
21. Uninstall-7Zip

How to run the script:

1. Save the above code into a file with a .ps1 extension, like InstallAndUninstall7Zip.ps1.
2. Open PowerShell as an administrator.
3. Navigate to the folder where you saved InstallAndUninstall7Zip.ps1.
4. Run the script by typing .\InstallAndUninstall7Zip.ps1.

Important Notes:

• Make sure you run the PowerShell script as an administrator.
• Modify the $installerPath variable to point to the actual location of your 7-Zip installer.
• This is just a sample script for educational purposes. In a production environment, you may need additional error handling, logging, and other features.

By running this script, 7-Zip will be installed and then uninstalled after a 10-second pause. Modify the script as per your application's and environment's requirements.

 

I don't know if I can make a big hit, but how can I persuade people to use Unity when everybody say it's a risk.

 

=)) Giving the community SSR, SSAO, Bloom, Refraction, Translucency , Tesselation was to hard of a job to do. Now you got your user base sweeped away to Unreal Engine or Godot. Perhaps even Cryengine will get few people after all this display of pure stupidity. Aslo, a very well done to the forum community, you were in their posterior all this time now they treated you like the fools you are. Very good job indeed.

 

How so ?

Everyone that has lot of sales can go to debt

Sell 10.000.000 copies with $0.1 and you are going to prison. You get 1 million profit and Unity asks for 2 million. Your life is over.