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Unity 4 is too expensive

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by unity3dx, Jun 21, 2012.

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  1. unity3dx

    unity3dx

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    Ok I have received an great email from Marvin Kharrazi, account executive from Latin America (I'am in Asia bug) who tells me that I get the privilege to get access to the beta, plus still enjoy 3.5 features (what a privilege!) and I get a preferred price, if I purchase my upgrade NOW!

    I upgraded 2 times since I purchased Unity 2.x and I have about 5 clients who purchased because I introduced them to Unity. Last time I got a $1,700 invoice to get my Unity upgraded.

    Now I run on the shop to check what is the preferred price pitched in Marvin email...



    $3050 to spend? And the preferred price is $850 for the upgrade of PRO or iPhone.

    What happen here? I purchased C4 $250, Garagegame $145, Renderware $250. And now I need to pay $3050 for an upgrade?

    Let's be real and strait, and too bad if many fanboys here will flame me: THIS IS TOO EXPENSIVE.

    Upgrade from Lion to Mountain Lion is $24. And even Windows 8 will cost around $200. The CEO/CFO at Unity must have read too much about Facebook and dream of a similar rip off, I cannot see any logic in this business model.

    The idea that every time you add features to a product, the product must be more expensive is plain stupid. Microsoft didn't do that, not even Apple or any software company because it will fail.

    Imagine, DOS+DOS32+Windows+Windows32+XP+Vista+Vista64+Windows 7+Windows 7 RC1+ Windows 7 RC2 = 1 Million bucks?

    That's exactly what Unity does. Every time they add something, they increase the price. Did Microsoft add +$800 to their product when they added a firewall, support to new hard drive etc...?

    Let's think about the future of Unity what people will have to buy in 4 years?
    Android: $1500 + PC/MAC: $1500 + iOS:$1500 + Windows Mobile: $1500 + Samsung Mobile: +$1500 + Flash: $1500 + Chrome: $1500 + adlib

    Well done: Unity $10,000

    When my customers sees the price for the upgrade, they laugh at me... I feel embarrassed to have pushed them in a dead end where they are ripped like chickens.

    So I will NOT upgrade, and my customers will NOT upgrade. You just lost $15,000. If you think you don't care because you have +1 Million users, think twice. I think you will not sell V4 period.

    Remember, and I hope some executive will go down from their ivory tower to read this post: there is a reason why Unity support PC AND MAC together and not PC+$1500 and MAC+$1500

    Yes Unity cost was $450 for PC and MAC, that's what's make its huge momentum in the first place. Having new platforms was a bonus and everyone was happy, until they asked to pay for iOS and good luck we get iPAD and iPhone for the same price, I am sure they had a debate about it!

    So now Unity is TOO EXPENSIVE, the community will split, use warez, or just get pissed and turn to something else. Hopefully a competitor will see the door open and slash its price and everybody will pack his bag and move on... It did happened with Renderware, Garage Games, Blitz Basic, Dark Basic etc... and will happen again here.

    Rip

     

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    Last edited: Jun 21, 2012
  2. amit1532

    amit1532

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    I hope they will do something about it.. I want to upgrade but i dont know if something is going to change so ill wait a bit...
     
  3. Jaimi

    Jaimi

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    Is that the preferred price? I thought they said you had to contact them, and they would give you a preferred price.

    Plus - It looks like you are buying a new Android Pro license. Is that not correct?
     
  4. Khyrid

    Khyrid

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    If it's too expensive, doesn't that mean you paid thousands for a program you can't make thousands of dollars with? You make zero profit?
     
  5. unity3dx

    unity3dx

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    This is non sense. You do not pay a program relatively to the money you might get if in the future one day you make a success. Do you know that People are using After Effect for doing special Fx in movies. If Adobe were thinking like you, they would sell their program ,$100,000 bucks. And some people made hit, playing on a guitar. wooooo this guitar should be sold $1 M bucks!

    The idea to add more $1500 for each platform, is stupid. It is like selling Photoshop with only ,PNG format, and have to buy Photoshop again for jpeg, gif or whatever. We should pay Unity 1 time $1500. And all platforms included.
    They would sell a load more.
    Now who can really spend +$5000 for a tool when you can actually develop the same for free using XCode.
    My customers have money. They are big companies. But they do not understand why they have to pay so much.
    They say, why you need to buy $5000 when we can hire someone to do the same and pay only him.
    Most games on iTune are made without Unity. That mean there are others ways, cheaper, to make games.
    I am ok to pay $1500 for a great tool, I buy 3DSMAX etc... but now I say it again and loud: IT IS TOO EXPENSIVE.
    That does not mean I am broke. But I am not stupid, my customers are not stupid and the whole business model is doing down in the water.
    They will not sell and wake up and change their price model I am %100 sure of it. It is just a matter of time until they fire the one who got this great idea.

    And Jaimi, yes I buy Android. I have Android right now, I do not want to loose it. I do not want Photoshop with one format. I pay one software I want to use it as much as possible. Unity is called Unity for a reason.
     
  6. pivotraze

    pivotraze

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    Unity's Business model is no different than it was when they sold 3.0, possibly when they sold 1.0, except for the Unity Indie.

    Regardless, if your clients are big companies, it should be no problem to shell out $5,000. Much less than $300,000 for competing engines.
     
  7. Wild-Factor

    Wild-Factor

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    If you use a car for your job, that mean you would spend 3 000$ to upgrade your wheel ??? Because you earn money with it ?
    Unity + office + taxes + chair + computer + photoshop + 3dsmax + yourself etc... Even if Unity is really great, it's only a fraction of a production pipeline. And it can't take a share of the pie to high, or you go bank·rupt.

    For an IOS game budget, 3000$ is very high. For IOS, Unity is one of the most expensif soltion you have on the market.
    But for PC it's the opposite. It's a real bargain.

    This always amaze me, people happy to pay more !
     
  8. AcidArrow

    AcidArrow

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    From that screenshot, it seems that you own Android Basic and you are upgrading to Android Pro. Which is why the upgrade price is 1350.
     
  9. Starsman Games

    Starsman Games

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    It seems a huge chunk of your "upgrade" is not upgrade, your screenshot shows you are purchasing Android Pro. Currently you own Android Basic, if you upgrade Android basic to... well, 4.0 basic it's going to cost you $1950 instead of $3050.

    If you don't upgrade Android, you will be paying the same $1700 you are used to.

    If you owned Android Pro alredy, your upgrade price now would be $2550
     
  10. Jaimi

    Jaimi

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    I'm interested in if this is the actual "preferred price". I too got an email, but I'm not going to bother to pursue the "preferred price" if it's the same as the normal upgrade price.
     
  11. Starsman Games

    Starsman Games

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    From what has been explained so far: (I have given up on the forums for the last few days and accidentally opened this page up :p) the "prefered" price, or discount, is a $200 coupon you can use in a future order.

    It has been told you can just upgrade Unity Pro core now for 850, get the coupon, then use the coupon to upgrade your mobile license. That cuts down your purchase by $200. The offer is only valid during the pre-order window, once it comes out the $200 offer goes away.
     
  12. unity3dx

    unity3dx

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    I do not agree, big companies are careful about their money. If they hire you to do a job, they do not understand why they have to pay $5000 extra when other developers who are coding in OBJ C can do the same.
    Ubi, EA etc... already have their own internal engine and do not care about Unity. The ones who cares are companies who are not in the video game business or want to reach iPad/iPhone etc... they are in the middle.
    When they create a website, they do not spend that much money to get rid of an anoing "Made with" and get all the features.
    They do not understand this business model. This is killing the developers business. I could ask a company to buy $1600 for PC/MAC/iPhone, now it is getting too expensive. The customer who already purchase do not want to upgrade, and I loose the business.
     
  13. Eric5h5

    Eric5h5

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    I don't think increasing the upgrade prices was a good move, but a lot of what you said makes no sense, or is flat-out wrong. For one thing, Windows sells millions upon millions of licenses, Unity sells far fewer, to a completely different market. You need to look up "economies of scale"; actually comparing Windows licenses with Unity licenses is not a thing anyone would do if they're trying to make a serious point.

    No, you're seriously confused; that was never the case. Unity was always $1500 from the beginning. There was an indie version for $250 originally (which did not publish to PC, you needed Pro for that!), then they dropped it to $200 (and included PC publishing for free), then they dropped it to $0. Unity Pro was always $1500, and considering how long it's been around, accounting for inflation, that means realistically the price is actually a little lower now.

    That's completely wrong, there were no new platforms until iOS, which was a paid-for platform (and a separate app) from the start. I can be pretty confident saying they did not debate about charging extra for iPad; iOS is iOS.

    Er, no, there's no such thing as "Samsung Mobile", that's just Android. Chrome is already part of the standard publishing options and doesn't cost extra. They're adding Linux as a standard publishing option, which also won't cost extra. As I mentioned earlier, Windows publishing went from $1500 to $0. So they've consolidated or added new platforms for $0 as often as they've added paid platforms, which seems pretty reasonable. (Although I admit I was never was keen on the whole Flash platform thing in any form.)

    --Eric
     
  14. unity3dx

    unity3dx

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    Good that they do not give you a mailing rebate. That's not a discount. And it also demonstrate another thing, not only Unity is getting too expensive, but you also have to buy more in the shop to get what Crytek and UDK give for free.

     
  15. kurylo3d

    kurylo3d

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    Your reasons for complaining are pretty weak. Unity is way better then any of those small time engines you mentioned. Its got more features and an awesome community. The fact that unity gives up a free version for people to use is incredable. You cant be pleased, thats the honest truth. If unity was $800 from the start ud get obset for them making you upgrade.

    You want to talk about photoshop, autodesk charges a lot more then unity for 3ds max or maya. So yes buy it if you plan on making money off it. Buy it if your enthusiastic about the features, but dont complain about an engine that is giving you AAA quality features at a fraction of the cost. Unity is buying up other companies so they can release these new features. Think about that for a second. Your not spending hundreds of thousands of dollars for things like beast lightmapping or occlusion or this new animation system. Your getting it with your purchase of unity. They are incredable for ONLY making it $1500. I mean there price point is charitable. If you dont like it go use cryengine 3. They let you use there engine for free and take 20 % off of whatever you make. Or you can pay them a million dollars and not let them take any ....Good luck. Unity allows you to make millions and not give them anything more then $1500... i think its a good tradeoff even if they arent as advanced.

    Ill stick with unity since its a great experience and awesome for multiplatform.

    Before you complain. Think about how much money it cost unity to add these new features. (Espeacially when it comes to buying a company to add one) They need to profit somehow.
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2012
  16. AcidArrow

    AcidArrow

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    This doesn't make much sense. You shouldn't make up the cost of Unity from only one client.
     
  17. Khyrid

    Khyrid

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    Yes it would. if your car breaks you don't have a job. Car repairs can be expensive, even in the thousands. But you can also buy another junker as opposed to fixing it, while with Unity, it doesn't matter how many 3.5 licenses you buy. The analogy kind of breaks down.
     
  18. Phil™

    Phil™

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    If you read what he wrote, he clearly states "my customers won't upgrade". Clearly the people he is working with/for also need Unity. In my experience, this is often the case. So he's not passing the cost on. They have the cost too.
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2012
  19. brilliantgames

    brilliantgames

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    I'm not sure what I'm going to do if I have to see another thread saying something along the lines of...Unity 4 is too expensive...I want to Sue Unity...The people at Unity are meanies and make me cry....My daddy never loved me....I listen to linkin park...I cut myself. ;)
     
  20. unity3dx

    unity3dx

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    I got Unity PRO upgrade + Unity iPhone for : $1198
    There was no such iPhone PRO at this stage, everyone got everything and that was better and cheaper.

    But when Unity added Windows to the MAC version: it was free.
    And when they added iPhone: cost was $399

    Now they add anything, it costs $1500, HTML 5 is coming and I see many ways to get more $1500+$1500+$1500

    Great if some can spend that money... if I was doing so, I would not be in business after +20 years for sure...
     
  21. digitalsoapbox

    digitalsoapbox

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    Everything in the above quote is highly misinformed and inaccurate. There are, in fact, composting tools that cost tens of thousands of dollars. Back when high-end 3D software only ran on expensive SGI machines, it was also tens of thousands of dollars, on top of the tens and sometimes hundreds of thousands of dollars in computer equipment. A "low-end" SGI machine cost $20,000.

    The Adobe Creative Suite upgrade costs are comparatively cheaper than the Unity 4 upgrade costs. After Effects alone sells for about half of what it sold for 10 years ago. 3DSMAX is cheaper. Maya is about 80% cheaper than it was when it was first released.

    The idea that they After Effects is used to do a lot of high-end film compositing is simply not true. Don't compare apples to oranges.

    Also, there are guitars that sell for that much.
     
  22. kurylo3d

    kurylo3d

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    If your buisness cant afford $1500 after a year of being in buisness... then my friend your a poor buisnessman. Not to mention you dont really have much of a buisness.

    oh and at the above post... maya just a year or 2 ago went from being like $2000 to $5000.. I think they lowered the costs again , but the high end version of maya im pretty sure is still around that $4000 mark.

    Correction, just looked it up... the normal maya is $3495 dollars.. thats without any of the bonus stuff. Few years ago it awas around $2000
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2012
  23. danXforx

    danXforx

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    i agree with unit3dx ,unity is stupid to offer a license for each platform
     
  24. Khyrid

    Khyrid

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    They have to make support for each platform, they should be paid for their work. Each platform you can make your game for gives you more opportunity to make money. It's smart for them to sell each platform and it's smart for you to buy it, if you know what you're doing.
     
  25. J_P_

    J_P_

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    I wish I could buy iOS Pro without buying the desktop Pro features I never use.
     
  26. brilliantgames

    brilliantgames

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    No thats smart business. Plus if you are a developer, and are only targeting one platform, why would you want to pay for every single one?
     
  27. J_P_

    J_P_

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    Mobile Pro developers DO pay for Pro features on PC/Mac/Web that we never get to use. The big new thing in 4 is an animation system that is mainly only useful for high end games on PC/Console -- it's going to cost me $1700 to upgrade to 4 (iOS Pro + Pro) and I won't really be getting any big new features that are useful to me.
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2012
  28. Deleted User

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    Actually maya got a price drop to ~4000EUR, because they are selling only the Unlimited version now - before there where Complete (~3000EUR) and Unlimited (~8000EUR)

    I have to agree, Unity is expensive, but you have to pay for professional tools - and Unity Technology also needs to pay their staff, etc.
     
  29. unity3dx

    unity3dx

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    Cool man, send me $3500, I will get your logo on the main page. Contact me in private for my paypal.
     
  30. kurylo3d

    kurylo3d

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    Your in the wrong buisness

    You know what they say. You get what you pay for.
     
  31. Integria

    Integria

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    If it's worth the money to you, buy the upgrade.
    If it isn't, don't buy it.

    Also, don't make silly arguments, such as trying to compare it to Windows. I have no clue where that even stems from.
     
  32. JamesLeeNZ

    JamesLeeNZ

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    Im not happy with the upgrade price. I brought pro less than a year ago. Im still working on turning that into profit. Big games take a lot of time to make, so I might not even be able to turn it to profit for another 6 months at least..

    Would like to have the new features, but if that means I have to shell out another $1400NZD, im going to have to hold off... Ive already sunk a too much money into this little venture.

    It might be enough to push me off to using UDK for the next game.
     
  33. commodore

    commodore

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    Wait so people who bought the last version of Unity have to pay more for an upgrade? What a rip off. i want to buy Unity pro for a couple of features but I'm not really planning on making much money and don't want to have to keep paying for more upgrades
     
  34. Khyrid

    Khyrid

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    The logic is that when you buy 4.0 from 3.5 you had the luxury of being able to use 3.5 so you pay more. Those who are new customers only just now get to use pro so they pay less. I don't like it either, but that's what they decided to do. Just give them the money and nobody gets hurt, nobody try to be a hero.
     
  35. Eric5h5

    Eric5h5

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    I guess you've never bought software before? It's not a "rip off", it's extremely common practice. Generally you pay for software upgrades...development isn't free. I kinda hate to bring up Windows again, but in this case it's apt...show me a version of Windows that wasn't a paid upgrade. If you bought Windows 95 and kept up with it all these years, you would have also paid for, at least, Windows 98, Windows Me, Windows XP, Windows Vista, Windows 7, and soon Windows 8. Whereas someone just buying into it just now for the first time would only pay for Windows 8.

    --Eric
     
  36. CharlieSamways

    CharlieSamways

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    Software pricing is more than fair, I think the upgrade cost is a bit S*** for 3.5 pro users, but Im going to happily pay that much.
     
  37. linusnorden

    linusnorden

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    I payed 3000 dollar just a few month ago for pro and IOS pro and now i have to pay 1700 dollar more... hehe To bad i didn't buy the license a few month later....

    No it doesn't feel right.. :-( and the fact that the GUI is not there makes it even worse... If i ever going to do a upgrade its going to be when the GUI engine is finished....
     
  38. outtoplay

    outtoplay

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    I'd pay gladly...if I could copy a keyframe in the animation editor.
     
  39. Swearsoft

    Swearsoft

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    Maya had a "pro version" with all the features that cost almost 7K$, when they were acquired by Autodesk this was stopped and pricing matched that of 3dsmax. They also charge for upgrades every year.
     
  40. Swearsoft

    Swearsoft

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    If you purchased Pro and planned to use pro with the features included, then stick to 3.5 for the project. If you purchased based on the roadmap then it was a poor decision, because those features were not guaranteed and even if they were you had no way of telling how the new GUI would work, so how could you make a decision on using it?

    The features that are included in 4, were not available in 3 or 3.5 if you needed them you weren't really looking. I only purchased Pro when I needed the features, Android when I needed Android etc and only when I could cover it. Now if I want 4 I will wait until the features are needed and they can be covered.

    Now if you are developing a personal project and you see some nice features you want from version 4 you should understand that at some point you have to complete the game, always updating it based on the competition or possible engine advancements will lead nowhere.
     
  41. Swearsoft

    Swearsoft

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    You DON'T have to pay another 1700$, you CAN pay another 1700$ when and if you need the NEW features.
     
  42. Moonjump

    Moonjump

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    There is Samsung Bada. It is a smart phone OS, but even after several years it has only appeared on the Samsung Wave series of phones. It looked quite neat when launched, but went nowhere.

    Having an argument about the price of a theoretical addition that is unlikely to appear is a bit odd, but the Unity 4 update is a lot more expensive than to 3. A search lists the Unity 3 Pro promotional preorder price as $1200 for new purchases and $500 for upgrades, and I remember that price lasting many months. It is all very different this time.
     
  43. J_P_

    J_P_

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    Except when 3.5 support is dropped and isn't compatible with future iOS versions and you can't make games any more. Thankfully they've confirmed at least iOS6 would be supported by 3.x so I can wait on 4.

    It'd be nice if my reason for upgrading was because of the new features of 4 though (shouldn't that always be the reason to upgrade?) -- but based on the current feature list, my reason for upgrading will likely be "so I can continue making games" since most of 4's new features are aimed at high end console and PC titles.
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2012
  44. makeshiftwings

    makeshiftwings

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    I agree, especially since I bought my 3.5 licenses right before they announced the 4.0 release, and now they want an extra $850 per copy just because I didn't wait a few days more before giving them my money. I picture their marketing team high fiving each other and cheering for every person they ripped off like this before the surprise 4.0 announcement.

    But yeah, tell me that all "real" businesses would just love to pay an extra $850 per person and that everyone who doesn't want to immediately throw more money at Unity isn't a "real" developer. That will definitely make me like their product and this community more.
     
  45. keithsoulasa

    keithsoulasa

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    Theirs a reason you can use Basic until you hit 100k in Revenue , in which case all the engine coding( along with access to half done projects off the asset store for an additional fee ) and getting to port to IOS and Android come to 5% of your yearly revenue . A engine coder will easily run you 50k, 60k a year . Its a good deal man
     
  46. DanielQuick

    DanielQuick

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    What do you want them to do? Stop selling licenses for the month before the next version is announced? Then those that bought it right before the store went down would be upset...

    It's not ideal, but there's nothing they can do. Someone will always be upset.


    You don't have to upgrade every license. It's only extremely expensive if you're developing for every single platform in which case, it's going to be expensive no matter which engine you use.
     
  47. Orion

    Orion

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    I miss the old days when you bought 2.6 and got 3.0 for free. I wouldn't complain if you didn't have pay to upgrade for each plugin as well - as if those weren't expensive enough on their own already.
     
  48. JamesLeeNZ

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    I purchased pro because I needed the pro features at the time. Fine thats ok. Im happy with that. I wasnt looking ahead too far. In saying that, I didnt realise major releases were going to set me back a large chunk of change. I know upgrades shouldnt be free, and I dont expect them to be, but I dont want to have to pay so much when there are only a few minor features coming out in the new version I would like.

    I can live without DX11 and the animation thing, which looks pretty cool, but I don't really need them. One thing I would like access to is a new GUI system and dynamic object avoidance path finding.

    What I would like to see is an upgrade price that allows me to choose features and upgrade them as needed. If I could upgrade to pro 4 without dx11 and animation and it only cost me $250Eur that would be all good with me. I want dx11, I pay another 250eu, animation, another 250eu. etc

    Sure it makes licencing a bit more to manage, but it would be a much nicer option.
     
  49. I am da bawss

    I am da bawss

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    All that talk about upgrade price now got me curious.

    What was the actual upgrade price in previous version? From 1.x to 2.x, and from 2.x to 3.x??
    Because I have only heard of the upgrade price been HALF of actual product price. Meaning it should be $750 for the PRO upgrades (Desktop/iOS/Android).

    Since the price is now $850, it seems UT just bumped the upgrade price by $100, but they do offer $200 "coupon" if you buy it now. In all honesty, I think that's a poor business move. That $200 coupon you have to spent it WITHIN ONE YEAR if I am not mistaken.... So I would rather UT just take $200 off the actual upgrade price then giving me $200 coupon.

    Also, people, remember, YOU GOT OPTIONS !! If you think Unity is becoming too expensive - you can always vote with your feet - go with UDK or CryEngine or any Open Source game engine; or DON'T UPGRADE !

    Another thing, around Christmas, UT usually give special pricing for Unity - like 30% off. I am not sure but I think at one time 50% off. So another option is to hold off on the upgrade, and wait for those specials.
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2012
  50. Starsman Games

    Starsman Games

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    It's not mailin. You get it instantly.
     
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