Twin stick shooters.

Love them or hate them? Feel strongly either way?

I recently saw this one on Kongregate:

Seemed pretty popular (80,000 plays in a week) and I noticed a lot of the little things they did right. For one, it's a sequel in an (apparently) popular series. But beyond that... it's pretty good.

Interestingly enough, the players have left comments suggesting ways it can be improved... a multiple shot upgrade, for one.

What do you guys think about this kind of game play?

 

I suppose this is a good time to go on a tirade about how genre shouldn't be defined by mechanics. The actual genre of twin stick shooters is mostly crap, with games that are little more than their base mechanic. More often than not you've expunged all the depth the game has after thirty minutes.

Outside the genre though, you can find plenty of games that use the mechanic just fine, but in talking about those games you would rarely, if ever, call them a twin stick shooter. It's only if you talk about the control scheme that it would be worth mentioning it has a twin stick setup. Out of The Binding of Isaac, Hotline Miami, and Terraria, Hotline Miami is the only one you might legitimately call a twin stick shooter in passing, mostly because the combat is the first thing you would likely talk about. All of those games use the mechanic (and use it just fine), but it is one mechanic of a much larger whole. Saying they are twin stick shooters does very little to actually describe their gameplay, and most people are going to look past it to get at the other mechanics of the game.

At the very least, the mechanic is better received than tank controls.

 

These I don't mind if they're done well & use controllers. Keyboard & mouse is just beyond me, I've tried & I just can't get used to it. They fill in time, lend themselves to a basic story, & give ample opportunity for power ups, levelling, pets, random loot & other things that can sink their psychological hooks into you.

 

Love twin stick shooters.

But I have to ask, why the hell does a web game have a story?

 

because "it's all about the experience/immersion/(insert latest gaming trend here)"

 

I think the real issue would be if there were no story. At least from the average gamer's perspective, a game without a story isn't enough. It's like a cake without frosting. There's almost this question of "you call this a game? where's the story?" At least, that's what all of my personal experience tells me. Some of the most popular games are the ones with the best immersion and most compelling narratives. I don't think it's evident of a trend. I think this is how things are going to be, going forward.

Me? I believed for a long time that game developers were trying to emulate film, but that was just my own hubris talking. People want their games to allow them to interact with stories, rather than simply observe that story unfold in a movie. Where the immersion is high, you'll find gamers play longer and tolerate gameplay shortcomings more.

The craziest thing is that the shift has already happened. Those of us insistent upon the "old ways" or the "good old days of classic gaming" are incidentally viewed as Luddites and behind the times.

 

Sorry, but for me, if I want that kind of experience I'm going to play Witcher or something like that.

Web games are more like, "I'm bored and I have a few minutes to kill". I don't want to spend that time looking at dialog in a tiny window.

 

That's you. For some people, a game like The Witcher is not an option. They might be on grandma's computer in the den, or at work on break or they could be semi-broke and looking to kill some time while drinking an Arizona Grapeade, getting ready to go have a cigarette. Maybe they're just not ready for a commitment right now... they're looking for something casual and discrete. Lol. I don't know all the reasons why, but I do know that people's wants and needs are extremely diverse when it comes to gaming.

I happen to agree with you about the tiny window. I plan on having very little dialogue, in very simple, short sentences in my game. "THE PRINCESS IS YOUR SISTER...", "YOU MUST SAVE THE KINGDOM" "YOU ARE OUR ONLY HOPE"... It's not Lord of the Rings guys.

 

The game it's self looks fun though.

 

So, updating old style games with one sentence stories to modern twin stick gameplay & letting the player make the rest of the story in their head without even knowing they are doing it as the graphical play on screen fills in the rest?

 

Yeah. Should be cool.

 

I played it for a while, made it past the first boss but after that it got abit grindy (I got to the fire temple and it took me 7 minutes to beat a level -- and if you die you have to redo the whole thing again). I guess one of there games in the same series got greenlight

 

I generally like these kind of games - `arena shooters` ... not always, some are better than others. Kind of goes way back to the likes of llamatron/robotron. Geometry Wars springs to mind... not quite sure I like the twin-stick control system, it can be a bit complex to keep track of whether you're focussing on the left or right control.

 

I played the first two stages and I realized it was just wash, rinse, repeat. I am adding some variety to the battles and putting in some exploration elements.

 

Look at robokill for example. Its definitely more fun to have some exploration (rather then being stuck in the same arena)
http://www.officegamespot.com/shooting/robokill.htm


Although a great arena shooter is Assault Android Cactus, but almost all of there arenas have a unique mechanic to it, and they have a weapon powerup system (the levels are never more then like 3 minutes).
http://store.steampowered.com/app/250110/

Last invader on the other hand actually keeps you in the same arena, but they spice it up with no regenerating health, perma-death and they have multiple weapons. How do they stop you from just using the "best weapon" all the time -- some waves they force you into a certain weapon-- but they also encourage you to switch weapons by giving you some extra gold (for switching weapons).
http://gamejolt.com/games/last-invader/74211

 

Perhaps, but then there are games made so well and made with more or less only their base mechanic in mind. Take Super Smash TV, it is a brilliant twin stick shooter with very little bells and whistles. It's the twin stick shoot-em up base mechanic, enhanced by co-op and a nice dystopian satire setting... But not much more. Yet, one of my favourite games.

 

Yeah its basically like anything someone whos a master chef/game-designer, probably make even a plain dish/game seem most excellent. But for the rest of its like add some hot sauce to our bland chicken and rice.

 

Brilliantly said. It's exactly like that, I think. Just look at some of the best games ever, there are so many that are just basic, single genre clones of some other game. But they do it well. Granted, even a master chef would have a hard time selling Mac n' Cheese in a fine dining restaurant. So you jack it up with some fresh crab and make it extra spicy, serve it alongside strips of grilled steak and twice baked potato.

 

They try

http://www.jamieoliver.com/recipes/pasta-recipes/a-killer-mac-n-cheese/#bFEVqOTPKPFx7RUm.97

 

"With sweet tomatoes and a beautiful crunchy topping"

That's basically what I want to make, a basic twin stick shooter "
With sweet tomatoes and a beautiful crunchy topping"