Search Unity

The mess in the Learn section

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by APSchmidt, Apr 24, 2019.

  1. APSchmidt

    APSchmidt

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    Sure but it's a pity we have to use a search engine to find what we need (and I prefer DuckDuckGo).

    Capture.JPG
     
  2. Antypodish

    Antypodish

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    Seams like over complicating query. No new learning person about loops, will type anything like this. ;)
    But if anything, that is simpler.
    upload_2019-5-6_8-5-6.png

    And more likely will happen following, while probably will by just looking for C# if loop
    upload_2019-5-6_8-7-18.png

    Either way
    As an example, if typing if on Learn section
    upload_2019-5-6_8-10-46.png
    , or loops
    upload_2019-5-6_8-12-49.png

    To be honest, search result was immediate for me, in new Learn.

    However, I will ignore elaborating on GUI at this time (waste of my pixalated space and time on my screen) ... :/
     

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  3. Ryiah

    Ryiah

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    Only if you don't want results exclusively from the website you specify. Whenever I assist people with finding a reference they were searching for I'll point it out as a way to greatly narrow down the results if you know the exact website that has the information you seek.

    You can even narrow it down further if you wanted to with "site:learn.unity.com/tutorial/" or "site:learn.unity.com/project/".
     
  4. Antypodish

    Antypodish

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    yep. But that is providing, you know where to look for information already.
    If you provide that query to asking person, that is fine.
    Yet, if using search engine, without such narrowing, search can give more reach results.

    Often we don't know where to look exactly. And in worse case, what to look for. Hence we do use synonyms.
    In my opinion, narrowing too strict, may potentially not yield desired results.

    However, yes, it works.
     
  5. neoshaman

    neoshaman

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    we are starting to power using the learn section, that's bad if that's for beginner :D
     
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  6. ptcmia

    ptcmia

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    They need to categorize the tutorials better. Instead of just popular and all tutorials.
     
  7. Owen-Reynolds

    Owen-Reynolds

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    [regarding "refer beginners directly to Learn"]

    Sounds like we're roughly in agreement then: it's called Learn, but it's not the primary place to send someone who has a serious, even very simple Q. "Alternative resources" are better.

    But the internet is big and Unity Forums is small. Despite your efforts here, people are being told to go to Learn, and the Learn button is prominent on the home page. It's going to keep being a problem.
     
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  8. Owen-Reynolds

    Owen-Reynolds

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    That's something I didn't even think of. But my point was the content, once you find it, isn't so great. Here's the IF example from Learn:

    Code (CSharp):
    1.  
    2.   float coffeeTemperature = 85.0f;
    3.   float hotLimitTemperature = 70.0f;
    4.   float coldLimitTemperature = 40.0f;
    5.    
    6.   void Update()  {
    7.     if(Input.GetKeyDown(KeyCode.Space))
    8.       TemperatureTest();
    9.        
    10.     coffeeTemperature -= Time.deltaTime * 5f;
    11.   }
    12.    
    13.   void TemperatureTest() {
    14.         // If the coffee's temperature is greater than the hottest drinking temperature...
    15.         if(coffeeTemperature > hotLimitTemperature) { // ... do this.
    16.             print("Coffee is too hot.");
    17.         } // If it isn't, but the coffee temperature is less than the coldest drinking temperature...
    18.         else if(coffeeTemperature < coldLimitTemperature) { // ... do this.
    19.             print("Coffee is too cold.");
    20.         } // If it is neither of those then...
    21.         else { // ... do this.
    22.             print("Coffee is just right.");
    23.         }
    24.   }
    That's the first and only one. Explain that in front of a class and you'll see the problems - it has way too much: global variables, a function in the test, calling a function, and cascading with a weird high, low, middle check. Plus it doesn't do anything interesting, and doesn't show the unique <=, != or ==. The video doesn't build up to it - just this all at once. You could learn from it, I believe you did, but it's no better than any other code snippet from a sample project and could be a lot better.
     
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  9. hippocoder

    hippocoder

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    Learn is actually fantastic cos there's 2 ways we can go from here:

    1. have a bunch of cheap paid content online, varying quality, no guarantees
    2. have a bunch of professionally authored content by unity kept relevant

    The ONLY thing that's bad is it's called "Learn" because learn implies a wide eyed innocent, and was historically free, so I would suggest @Aurore that you think about using the word training and change the learn link to redirect to training, or maybe clean up the messaging on the site a bit. Now, training is widely accepted as a professional and paid for thing.

    So people are in fact, only hype over a simple matter that's easily designed out. Of course there will always be free learn material, but training is a more professional approach.

    Not sure why people are worried, so long as Unity keeps pumping out content for learn and training.
     
  10. Kiwasi

    Kiwasi

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    I swear it was much better when I did it five years ago. Maybe my memory is just dodgy.

    I recall it showing a bunch of unity relevant things, not just something that you could do in a console app.

    But you are right, that example isn't especially great for a first point of call. Might as well go straight to MSDN.
     
  11. TenKHoursDev

    TenKHoursDev

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    For a game engine company with the mission to "democratize game development" --> this sure is anti-democracy.
     
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  12. Antypodish

    Antypodish

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    Either way, as it stands now Learn section, I will advise any new person, to look everywhere else, but Learn.
    This is how much I dislike it, when I look at it. I think mainly because of new layout.
    At the current state, it is not newbie friendly place at all in my opinion.
    I just feel weird, when I try browse it.
     
  13. GameDevCouple_I

    GameDevCouple_I

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    Whats anti democracy about it? Sort of confused as to what this has to do with "democracy" at all? In what way have your choices or voting power or voice been taken away by introduction of the new learn format?
     
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  14. hippocoder

    hippocoder

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    Of course not. But you're using a free engine if using personal, worth actually over 3 billion. So there's that. Paying for an optional purchase of training material is not objectionable.

    Have to be reasonable: we want to learn but game dev is so huge, some paid training is actually needed because everyone is making different things.

    There are still the forums and a web of free content plus Unity's own free content available. True, Learn section could use some cleanup of terms used and a cleaner signalling on the website but other than this I can't hate on Unity for it.

    In fact the learn team is IMHO one of the very best parts of Unity, and even an old hand like me has learned from it. Lets give them a tiny bit of slack here and look at how they could improve the website aspect.
     
  15. neoshaman

    neoshaman

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    That if sample is great if you come from another language (say, innocently, blitz3d), ie know the basics, and learn at a glance teh c# unity way.
     
  16. GameDevCouple_I

    GameDevCouple_I

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    I have to say, just the fact that the learn section has enough content now to warrant a visual revamp is pretty heartening. It certainly was not this easy to learn unity when I started out and would have killed for something like this back then.

    I still think the layout isnt great, but I also have used an engine for all hobbyist projects without having to legally pay any licensing fees for like 8-9 years now and have managed to build a career off the back of the skill, so I guess I should learn to complain less about free stuff that has been added to make my other free stuff easier to use.
     
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  17. Antypodish

    Antypodish

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    I think is good to complain, but in constructive way. Just by giving feedback, justifying why do you like, or don't like xyz.
    Sometimes right kick in the back side, can turn into good direction :)
     
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  18. Owen-Reynolds

    Owen-Reynolds

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    Learn now looks like the typical situation where you add stuff as 1-offs, just whatever to get content. The result is stuff that overlaps, and has gaps, and the intended audience and goal jumps all over the place. The fix is rewriting the content. Refactoring, if you will. It's that painful stage when someone thinks they have 30 videos, wants 60 total, and are half done; when in fact they have 30 hiding places for the good ideas they need to redo in a consistent way. In other words, going from 1) to 2) is a big step.

    Particle systems are the easiest and most fun things to show - here's how to make a smokestack, poison-status bubbles, falling leaves. But they don't do that. I found ParticleSystems in the "Unity for Artists" bubble (which seems odd, but fine). The basic one looks like a Preview at a live event from when Shuruken came out - quickly tapping through each option for people who haven't seen it yet. Fine at first, but needs to be cut. Add a version with prep. For the emitter shapes, have a Scene with a dozen variations pre-made. The video says "we'll pick this shader". Show them a Scene using them all, lined up.

    But beyond that, the video is just mechanics. The juice is "How do I make X". Put those videos (which aren't made) up front, and let the authors know they can say "for a longer explanation of why I picked this setting, check out ParticleSystem Options Part-II." Ideally, the mechanics section can reference some of the cool effects, as examples.

    Meanwhile, the explosion particle system is mostly scripting - FunWithExplosions is rigidbodies and raycasting. It might be fine in the Physics section, which has one video on Raycasting. But it doesn't tie into it. Or maybe it should be advertised as a Survey - here's what you can make, see raycasting, etc... sections for details. The next one "PIT" shows a little about making explosion particle systems, but also more scripting. It's what someone felt like making. But where's the obvious video: how to make a flash, rolling flames, blasting fiery bits, weedy black smoke plumes?
     
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  19. Antypodish

    Antypodish

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  20. APSchmidt

    APSchmidt

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  21. Antypodish

    Antypodish

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    Previously something caused by this popup
    upload_2019-5-23_19-13-15.png
    But can not replicate.
     
  22. APSchmidt

    APSchmidt

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    I just noticed that we can no longer open any page in the learn section in another tab or window. Middle mouse button clicking doesn't work and the option in the contextual menu is simply not there.

    I was here (https://learn.unity.com/project/beginner-gameplay-scripting) and I wanted to MM click on "Tutorials" to open it in a new tab so that I don't lose my page: no way! And there is no "open in a new tab" option in the contextual menu.
     
  23. AcidArrow

    AcidArrow

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    Nonsense, Unity is just keeping up with the latest trends.

    They are flattening the engine UI, they are gamifying the Learn section.

    As for web design I see clear inspirations from this.
     
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  24. Antypodish

    Antypodish

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