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Surforge 1.4.4 - 3D rendered PBR texturing in Unity

Discussion in 'Assets and Asset Store' started by Sergeyv_3d, Jan 27, 2017.

  1. Sergeyv_3d

    Sergeyv_3d

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    Thank you very much.

    Surforge was not initially designed for characters, if it is not sci-fi robots or character wearing helmet.
    I am planning to add some parts of common character equipment to kitbash list at some point. But i am afraid, Surforge hardly ever be able to create human faces.

    If there would be ability to insert texture of a person face into Surforge, it will be hard to match such texture with the UVs of your character face, as such UVs could be arbitrary shaped.
    This requires the advanced tools for painting on the model with texture transfer. All this have to be coded from scratch, as not initially planned and uses different texturing approach.

    Sure! You could add your own detail models, labels and other assets.
    Surforge is based on Unity prefabs, and you could create your own if needed, import models, setup custom Poly Lasso profiles. Its described in the user guide (only in general terms at this moment). Unfortunately, its not well documented now, and no convenient tools for its editing, as its early version of Surforge.
    The easiest way to do it now - to copy an existing prefab, check for its properties, edit what you whant and than add it to the appropriate list of Assets\Surforge\AddDetailTool\placeMeshes.prefab for Add Detail and Assets\Surforge\PolyLassoProfiles\polyLassoProfiles.prefab for PolyLasso prests, save project and restart Unity.
    You also need to create icons for it manually, for light and dark skin (excluding materials, their icons rendered automatically).
    Working with prefabs will be improved in future versions.

    Surforge material system is shader based. It gives you the advantage of real-time tweaking of all your material aspects.
    There is a limit of maximum number of texture samplers in your shader. It is not enough for use Surforge advanced material features, such as customizable worn edges, noises, emission, paint layers, dirt tweaking, on the top of imported Standard material.

    Surforge material system is handy and flexible. You could easily extract all needed specular/glossiness detail from diffuse texture, and much more. It would be a pity to exchange all of its strengths for the import of standard materials.
    Also, the exported maps are fully compatible with standard shader and common for specular based PBR pipeline. It is possible to tweak exported results in external texturing tools if needed.
     
    Mark_01 likes this.
  2. zenGarden

    zenGarden

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    You can't do it when your diffuse is a PBR diffuse without any other informations.
    For example you have a road tiling texture for diffuse, while the water on top of it is defined on the metalness/and roughness textures to get the wet effects.
     
  3. Sergeyv_3d

    Sergeyv_3d

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    You could achieve it with the paint mask. It has its own specular/glossiness settings and blends to the main material layer. You could also tweak its tiling, opacity, add noise and color tint. There are two paint masks in every surforge material.
     
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  4. zenGarden

    zenGarden

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    Some video example showing how to import and use our own PBR textures would be nice :)
     
  5. Sergeyv_3d

    Sergeyv_3d

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    It is also handy for creating variants of your material. If you need to make several different variants of weather effects on the different road textures, for example. You need just a set of masks, instead of use your image editor for each variant separately.
    Sure, i will do it.
    I am really sorry there is so lacking of videos. A lot of work based on email reports, all efforts aimed on the upcoming update.
     
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  6. thelebaron

    thelebaron

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    I picked it up the other day and really impressive stuff. But I had a thought: would you ever consider just a model detailing mode? Surforge is pretty incredible as it is, but as a modeler I'm really intrigued by the detailing part. A mode where you import a model and use the lasso to directly snap on the kitbash library parts would be amazing imo(obviously it would have to go through the manual low poly remesh uv etc).
     
  7. Sergeyv_3d

    Sergeyv_3d

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    Thank you very much.

    PolyLasso tool is possible, because it works on a plane. It uses simple and fast triangulation, because the bending deformation not needed.
    Same as for kitbash items. You use it on a plane too, and the result texture neatly "bends" on your model, thanks to UVs. If you start to just snap your kitbash items on your 3d model as it is, there will be nothing special.
    Highpoly retopology baking pipeline also requires a lot of hard work. Surforge was designed to let you avoid that work.
     
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2017
  8. SniperEvan

    SniperEvan

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    Hey guys, I made some Surforge tutorial videos.

    Overview of surforge:


    Here are some errors that I ran into, and how to get around them:


    And here is a simple object modeling and texturing tutorial.


    I love this asset and plan to make a bunch more tutorials using it. If you have a request for a specific model please comment on any of my videos and I'll make it! :D
     
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  9. Distant_Temples

    Distant_Temples

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    Thanks for taking the time to make those videos SniperEvan. I was able to pick up some important tips. I also liked how you showed some other apps and how they can work with Surforge. I look forward to more.
     
  10. Sergeyv_3d

    Sergeyv_3d

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    Incredible cool videos. Thank you so much!
    Buy the way, you should definitely check Evan Daley youtube channel. There are a lot of tutorials and other great stuff.

    Please, don't worry about the issues. I know about mentioned bugs, and working on the fixes.
    The update is almost ready.
     
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2017
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  11. Sergeyv_3d

    Sergeyv_3d

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    I would like to show you one more handy feature of the upcoming update.
    With this slider you could easily set the desired scale of PolyLasso object profiles, that you are going to create.
    fineDatail101.jpg
    Along with profile scale step for existing objects with a hotkey, this let you create a really fine detail and work even with tiny UV islands. Hope you like it.
     
  12. pixelsteam

    pixelsteam

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    Thank you for the excellent videos keep them coming!!!
     
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  13. SniperEvan

    SniperEvan

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    I was hoping you would add something like this.

    Thanks everyone for the positive feedback on my tutorials. Today I made a more in-depth video for the poly lasso tool. I hope you guys enjoy!

     
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  14. jc_lvngstn

    jc_lvngstn

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    SniperEvan, this is amazing. Have you considered using Unity to turn this into a separate application, instead of having it as an addon in Unity?
    I'm sure it would require work to create the UI within Unity, but it seems like there would be many benefits. The main ones being:
    • As a separate utility, it would always work outside of Unity. You wouldn't have to worry about compatibility between Unity versions. You could just export out the textures.
    • The community wouldn't have to be concerned about ongoing developer support, between Unity versions.
    I'm not saying it would be simple, but it seems to me that this is an amazing addon worthy of its own place as separate tool.
     
  15. SniperEvan

    SniperEvan

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    Hey jc. I didn't make this asset, I'm just a fan with a game dev YouTube channel (subscribe?). Sergeyv_3d is the developer! As far as creating a separate application, I'm sure it's possible but it wouldn't be able to take advantage of the architecture of the Unity editor that enables so many of its features. Personally, I really like that it runs in Unity. It means I can do 100% of my work within Blender and Unity. It's also an environment that I'm incredibly comfortable with.

    And since you mentioned exporting, surforge already has a built in feature for that. It outputs textures for diffuse color, specularity, normal, height, ambient occlusion, and emission. If you wanted to you could take the textures and use them in Unreal Engine or pretty much anything else with PBR shaders.

    Let me know if you want to see a tutorial for something specific! I need external motivation ;)
     
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  16. Sergeyv_3d

    Sergeyv_3d

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    Another great video, very detailed and clear. Thank you very much, Evan!

    As you could see, Surforge need UVs with gaps between islands, for its brand "UV Grid" mode. It supports overlapping only if your overlapped islands match vertex perfect.
    But, in classic UV mode with triangles you could use any UV layout you like, and create your shapes point by point, which is also very handy. You could use UV snapping in both modes. It snaps to everything: vertices, edges, other shapes your created.

    Surforge was originally planned as Unity Editor extension. It opens up great opportunities for fast development. Its hard to release standalone version, it will require to write a lot from scratch.
    I also don't see the need for standalone version. Unity Editor gives so much benefits. Standalone would never have so much flexibility. You could add your own prefabs, script things. You could use other tools with Surforge, tweak everything.
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2017
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  17. laurentlavigne

    laurentlavigne

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    Great tutorial! I'd like to see how parts of the faceted model can be made smooth with surforge (if possible) and also armor decoration would be fantastic since it would depart from the usual hard surface.
     
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  18. anzerkree

    anzerkree

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    Can you tell us when this update will be available?
     
  19. agito1987

    agito1987

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    Hey

    I have set up base panel lines and objects with the lasso and detail tool.
    I wanted to finish it up with some greebles noise.
    I played around with the tool all over my texture space, once I figured that I understand the tool I went ahead and deleted the greebels objects in the hierarchy (“New Game Object” objects).


    When I now want to continue to use the greebles I can only use the scatter feature or click where I want to spawn the firs objects. But when I want to use the grow function I get a null reference and nothing happens.

    My question now is:

    Is there a way to reset the greebels tool?
    Or is there a way to copy the lasso & detail object to a new scene?
     
  20. PaulMakesThings

    PaulMakesThings

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    This is great. I was just wondering about this because for some of the models I was trying to make, like RTS buildings, the lasso profiles were too large. Like bolt panels with bolts a quarter the size of a door, and cables half the width of a door.

    I'm trying to keep my suggestions to stuff within the scope of the tool. I was just skimming the manual for a way to do this. You mentioned a hotkey. Is there currently some way to change the profile sizes?
     
  21. Sergeyv_3d

    Sergeyv_3d

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    I am afraid Greeble tool is in the early development stage now. I will check the grow issue, thank you. You could use Greeble "scatter", it should work. You could use "remove in order" button to remove your greebles.

    There is no profile scale in 1.0 yet. You could adjust "root" object scale now, to make your detail smaller related to your texture.

    I really hope to submit the update this week.
     
    antoripa likes this.
  22. Mjercer

    Mjercer

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    Hi, I love how surforge looks!
    I am very eager to try it out, but I don't have the money yet and it may be awhile before I can buy it. I'm not asking for a free copy, but do you have any plans for a trial or basic version of this?

    I don't have much artistic ability and this looks like just the thing I need to get my models looking great!

    Looking forward to a reply, thank you!
     
  23. SniperEvan

    SniperEvan

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    Here is a video covering Material Sets and Material Adjustments. Enjoy :D



    If you like my tutorials please subscribe!
     
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  24. SniperEvan

    SniperEvan

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    Alright guys, the next tutorial is ready. This one covers greebles. Let me know if you have any questions :D

    I'm not sure if smoothing out a faceted surface is possible with surforge. Surforge is just projecting a material onto the geometry that is in place and it doesn't modify the geometry.

    And for the armor decoration, we could definitely paint cool patterns on the armor. When you say "depart from the surface of the model" I think we are stepping outside of the capabilities of surforge. We can't edit the model's geometry, so for that we would want to use something like blender to actually extrude the surface.
     
  25. Sergeyv_3d

    Sergeyv_3d

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    Great tutorials, thank you very much, Evan! Material Sets tutorial is my favorite.

    I should clarify some moments: when you tweak Detail intensity, contrast and shift for Specular and Glossines, you tweak how detail is extracted from the albedo texture. To tweak Specular/Glossiness values itself, please use Specular color box (darker colors is for less specular) and Glossiness slider. Paint layers has its own spec/gloss controls.

    Just to remind: Specular is reflection intensity and reflection color tint, Glossiness is for how much reflections are glossy/brushed, low values for dielectric materials, and high values for metals.

    As for adjust from Levels section (Gamma, min/max input/output): this group of sliders actually works as Levels adjustment in Photoshop, just the same algo.


    About the basic or demo version - I am afraid it's not really possible in the near future, because all my efforts aimed on main version improvements. Also separate version mean i have to update both items separately, which is just simply not possible now. Maybe I'll do it in the future, when main version will be shiny and perfect.
     
  26. Mjercer

    Mjercer

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    Ok, thank you for replying to the question!
    I did't think about the way that would add even more to your plate from all of the updates and seperate coding it would cause. I look forward to being able to purchase your product! I guess that brings one new question to my mind. With how much you are updating this, and all of the features you will be implementing (borderlands, medieval and other styles), will you be increasing the price? I would understand if so, just curious if it will be the same when I have the funds to purchase. Thanks again!
     
  27. Sergeyv_3d

    Sergeyv_3d

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    In the future, as the asset develops, yes. I'll write about the increase in prices in advance. In the near future it is not planned. Need to make all things to work as it should first.
     
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  28. SniperEvan

    SniperEvan

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    Here's a tutorial for the Polly Lasso Arc mode. Subscribe for regular game dev tutorials!
     
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  29. Distant_Temples

    Distant_Temples

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    Wow, this just keeps getting better. Thanks for bringing these features to light Evan. And of course, thanks for making such a cool asset Sergey.
     
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  30. jc_lvngstn

    jc_lvngstn

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    Excellent videos, thanks Evan!
     
  31. Cactus_on_Fire

    Cactus_on_Fire

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    This is an amazingly useful product and very easy to get a grip on. I finished this mech from start to finish in a couple of hours thanks to surforge, where as it would take a few days atleast with conventional modelling. This asset definitely needs more recognition.

     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2017
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  32. Epimolophant

    Epimolophant

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    Hi! I just got Surforge, but can't get it to work. Here are my steps:

    - Created a brand new Unity Project (5.5.1f1)
    - Downloaded and imported Surforge
    - Clicked on Window -> Surforge
    - Clicked on New Texture
    - Clicked on the [R] and dragged a simple model made in Blender to "Open model"

    Then, it didn't show the model (the default cube stayed there). So I restarted Unity and tried all the steps again. This time it shows the model, but Unity starts freezing constantly. A bunch of error messages kept popping up on the console:

    upload_2017-2-23_23-37-49.png

    IndexOutOfRangeException: Array index is out of range.
    SurforgeInterface.c30b504d191c736769edccb35fdf729f1 ()
    SurforgeInterface.c4f96238c6741ba2e33c7bc73614893c6 ()
    SurforgeInterface.cea0e7e0d1a2f57b8a532a42926b37fda (UnityEditor.SceneView cff9d82ed9d32d4d92e049f1056a9fa23)
    UnityEditor.SceneView.CallOnSceneGUI () (at C:/buildslave/unity/build/Editor/Mono/SceneView/SceneView.cs:2075)
    UnityEditor.SceneView.HandleSelectionAndOnSceneGUI () (at C:/buildslave/unity/build/Editor/Mono/SceneView/SceneView.cs:1405)
    UnityEditor.SceneView.OnGUI () (at C:/buildslave/unity/build/Editor/Mono/SceneView/SceneView.cs:1242)
    System.Reflection.MonoMethod.Invoke (System.Object obj, BindingFlags invokeAttr, System.Reflection.Binder binder, System.Object[] parameters, System.Globalization.CultureInfo culture) (at /Users/builduser/buildslave/mono/build/mcs/class/corlib/System.Reflection/MonoMethod.cs:222)
     
  33. Sergeyv_3d

    Sergeyv_3d

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    Hello. Thank you very much for using Surforge. I am very sorry that you faced this error. Please don't worry.

    You may need press "Window - Layouts - Revert Factory Settings" after first launch. Its easily fixes possible issues on some systems. This needed if PolyLasso tool and AddDetail tool not moving at all, no UVs shown, need only once. There are also some issues with Blender models in 1.0

    This is already fixed, i am preparing update for the submission.
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2017
  34. Sergeyv_3d

    Sergeyv_3d

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    Fasten your seatbelts, guys. I would like to show you something completely awesome.
    I contacted ProBuilder developer, and after some code tweaks:

    Meet Surforge + ProBuilder workflow!

    This, and not only, awaits you in Surforge 1.0.1, which is already submitted for review.
    Along with countless bug fixes, its full of useful stuff and workflow improvements.

    It is you, my dear customers, who making it possible. Thank you!
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2017
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  35. lundon

    lundon

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    Fantastic! Will we need to wait for an update to ProBuilder as well?
     
  36. tango209

    tango209

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    That's awesome. It's going to simplify my workflow quite a bit.
     
  37. Sergeyv_3d

    Sergeyv_3d

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    You don't need to update ProBuilder to use it. "Mesh are assets" option was there already before Surforge. Developer kindly gave me a hint to use it.
     
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  38. Distant_Temples

    Distant_Temples

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    . And the peasants rejoice!!!!!!

     
  39. anzerkree

    anzerkree

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    Free this damn update !!! i can't wait anymore
     
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  40. pixelsteam

    pixelsteam

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    Excited to get started with this asset. I seem to have a problem. My model is comprised of many pieces, yet my FBX is self contained. But I cannot drag in my fbx. What is the best way to prepare my model and uv mapping for importing into Surforge.
    I tried with the surforge demo content hit render and geometry and uv mapping not showing up.
    Thanks
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2017
  41. thelebaron

    thelebaron

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    Some questions/feature requests:

    - Is it possible to change the grid size?
    - When using the poly lasso to cut, is it possible to cut an island in an object? Like a square within a square without needing to go to the edges?
    - For the materials tab, would it be possible to have a tooltip for the material name when hovering the mouse over a material orb preview?
    - Will future versions remember the render settings(resolution, ao type etx)?
    - Will future versions support choosing the resolution for x and y? Say a 1024x512 texture?

    Thanks, this has fast become one of my favourite assets.
     
  42. lundon

    lundon

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    Yes, you can cut out an area inside an island.

    I asked Sergey a while back about tooltips for the material names. He said it was on the list for a future update.
     
  43. thelebaron

    thelebaron

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    is there a special trick to making an island cut? I cant seem to be able to do it
     
  44. Sergeyv_3d

    Sergeyv_3d

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    You may need press "Window - Layouts - Revert Factory Settings" after first launch. Its easily fixes possible issues on some systems.
    (this needed if PolyLasso tool and AddDetail tool not moving at all, no UVs shown, need only once).
    This is already fixed in 1.0.1 and will be no more needed after update go live.

    Can't drag and drop your model in the appropriate field, because the asset you dragged is a whole model prefab, but field type is "mesh".
    The mesh can be seen if you uncover your model asset content, in your project tab, and there are all child meshes, suitable for dragging into Surforge mesh field.
    In the future this will be improved at some point.

    If your model has no UVs, you could prepare your UV layout in Blender (free tool). There are handy video tutorials on youtube, how to unwrap your model using Blender.

    I am afraid you can't yet. This is not hard to add, will be added on some point, when i add "preferences" menu.

    I am afraid you can't do it in Surforge. When add booleans (islands with holes) the conception of boolean tree appears.
    Shapes no more have same rank, so things become more complicated and as result slower and less stable.

    If Surforge presets have just edge, with booleans it would have outer edge and set of inner edges.
    So edge related mesh construction more complicated.

    The cap mesh creation in Surforge use simple, stable and well optimised algo of convex polygon fill.
    For shapes with holes get by booleans, you need different algo, much slower, much less stable, generate heavier meshes.

    In result, there unreasonable amount of tricky tasks for really minor functionality.

    This is planned, but i am afraid it requires to create custom tooltips implementation, it takes time.

    This is easy to add, but it is better to start with a preview. You don't want to wait for every your new texture just created, to update high res preview at the beginning. I will add the ability to save this settings with the scene.

    This is really hard to implement, a lot of shader realtime stuff require square power of two textures. Also, its tightly connected to seamless editing and tons of code. If it would be added someday, definitely not soon. It's just not reasonable to spend time on it, while it could be used to create less tricky and more handy things. For now, you could use half of the texture space and cut exported maps in your image editor.

    I am afraid you can't do it. You could achieve most of the effect needed just with creating new PolyLasso object on top of your other PolyLasso objects. You could also split your shape in two halves.
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2017
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  45. thelebaron

    thelebaron

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    Thanks for the answers. I was thinking, maybe the lasso shapes inverted would be a nice substitute, similar to a few of the detail floaters? Would that be hard to implement?
     
  46. Sergeyv_3d

    Sergeyv_3d

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    There are several floater Poly Lasso profiles and profiles including floater child shapes.
    You could easily change profile of existing Poly Lasso object by selecting it in the scene and choosing desired preset while Poly Lasso tool is not active.
     
  47. Teila

    Teila

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    Those of you who have purchased and used Surforge, is it mainly for sci fi? I see nothing else but sci fi here.

    I wonder if someone could show off some non-metal results with Surforge. Thanks!
     
  48. thelebaron

    thelebaron

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    Ah completely ignored these until now! Thanks again.
     
  49. Sergeyv_3d

    Sergeyv_3d

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    You are right, current early version is mainly suited for creating sci-fi textures and simple neutral architectural elements.

    But you could use Surforge not only for sci-fi.

    I am going to add more presets and kitbash items of different themes in the future updates.
     
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  50. Sergeyv_3d

    Sergeyv_3d

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    All you need to start is a model with good UVs. There are a lot available for free on the Asset Store. The better your stuff mapped, the easier is to achieve results.

    I also used xNormal (free tool) to quick bake my low frequiency ambient occlusion, to use it as a base for Surforge AO.
     
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