story writing

dear friends,

I have question. how do you get better at story writing. how you engage viewer? What story is best and story type is most popular. By story here, i mean text only. pls share your view.

https://forum.unity.com/threads/dos-prompt-choose-adventure-game.830301/

 

This is a good new resource: https://medium.com/game-writing-guide

The best way to improve is to ask for and sincerely listen to feedback.

The most important thing to remember is that, in games, text is not the story. The player's actions are the story. More here: David Kuelz's Narrative Design Tips I Wish I'd Known

 

Techniques of the Best Selling Writer is the best instructional book I've read about storytelling.

Games is a different medium, so you are looking for the universal concepts there, not details. But it's a book you can read in a day and then reference back to later.

 

There are lot of books out there on the subject of creative writing.

Some things I've researched when trying to create my own stories are:
The Blake Snyder beat sheet:
https://www.studiobinder.com/blog/save-the-cat-beat-sheet/
It's a generic "Story Arc" outline (three-act-structure) that most Hollywood films follow, but the same over-all story arc can also be used in books and video games as well.

The other thing is "the Hero's Journey" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hero's_journey which is, similarly, a basic story-arc outline. This originated from academic studies of ancient myths and legends.

You could actually take both outlines and lay them on top of each other. A story could adhere to both simultaneously if you want.

 

ty for all feedback

I consider showing instead of telling. and practice the story writing phase.

 

Speaking of three act structures, I've seen level-design articles about how you can use that structure to design a level.
https://www.worldofleveldesign.com/.../level-design-pacing-gameplay-beats-part1.php

The way the player interacts with the environment creates a story in itself, so keep in mind that in game development you have lots of tools for story-telling other than just written words.

 

Check Amazon. There are some good books I used that specifically refer to writing for games. I used them to help me turn a story into a game..not an easy task for a writer. Most of us are used to controlling the story to the end. So it is quite different but a very fun challenge.

 

thank u friends i consider taking creative writing course this term

 

Good read, but i maybe not clear, it mainly text based like this https://store.steampowered.com/app/818150/Retro_Hacker/

 

Which article? If you're talking about David Kuelz's, the principles apply to all games. Take the first one, for example: Story starts with gameplay. The player's ability to participate is what makes it an interactive medium. If you're only going to follow old guides for writing traditional static fiction, you might as well shut down Unity and write a novel.

Some of the best text adventures don't necessarily have the greatest writing, but they let the player be an active participant in the story and try to do all kinds of things. The same is true for Twine games. In fact, you may want to make your first version in Twine before doing the MiniScript version. With Twine, you can skip the programming and just focus on the writing.

 

very good advices, i think i know what u mean now, that text story in game is not to dissimilar to regular game and not just novel.

twine look useful, someone point me to that before but i just glazed over.

For time being, joe strout helps me to get miniscript interpreter set up in unity. Once simple example is concluded to work satisfactory, i can start work with unity gui and simulate dos prompt.

in time, get to work on mobile and launch on ios or samsung shop with networked multiplayer, but many days down line.

I am very excited for my game, and it surely be great success with all helps so far.

 

I think something unique to games is how far you want to go forcing the player to conform to your story. In a book or movie story telling is arguably easier because you control the entire narrative, the pacing, the characters, etc. In a game you inherently give up some control of the story to the player.

There's different avenues you can try to follow with that aspect. You could force the player to exactly follow your story with little control over the outcome. You could create a branching story where the player's choices actually control which way the story goes. You could do something like Eve Online where the story itself is entirely written by the players, with the developers just creating the sandbox in which the story unfolds. Lots of options, and no right answer for all cases.

 

Yes, I think that's the appeal with this type of game, you can deviate from a traditional narrative and take it to the player. I've read 'choose your own adventure books' when I was younger, and they always interested me somewhat because of their unusual structure.

With these type of things the work increases exponentially because each decision tree branches exponentially, so you're not writing one narrative but many, and I feel that is going to be the hardest hurdle to overcome. At least from a game design POV.

 

Being a DM for couple of years would help.

I did write a fairly large post on the subject, BUT that post was a part of a thread of a user whose accoun was apaprently deleted. The thread - and the post - went along with it.

 

I'm doing a creative writing course this semester, and I always keep a diary/ notebook when out and about.

 

Hi friends I just stumbled on https://yarnspinner.dev/ will test tomorrow if time

 

Greetings, My name is Mario Leone. I work on Story within the film industry. I am here to answer any story questions for anybody. Anyone who has a question in regards to your story I am here to help you. You could wait two hours of books or you can get an answer directly from me.

Before we get started I want to share a few links with people. Just to show you what I do.

One of my projects was a short film with Gian Luca Frattelini (Prince of Persia) 3-D, Guardians of the Galaxy. He did a lot of Groot scenes..

The second link is my IMDb page.
https://www.imdb.com/name/nm6617489/

The third.
https://www.amazon.com/Inveigh-Wilma-Rivera/dp/B0868ZGDJG

The 4th Following feature ready to release 2020 October.

Why am I here? I’m here to help anyone that is having story trouble. Not to mention, I would like to specialize in story within the gaming realm because of my vast understanding and knowledge of technology. I started with games in 1978 on a commodore pet computer I wrote my first lines of code back then. Line 10 goto Line 20.

Today I’m a screenwriter and work in Film as fight choreographer. As per Covid I am here to help others.

At the end of the day all I wanna do is help you. I would be happy to help you no matter what your skill level. Please do pardon me as I don’t know the forum etiquette this is actually my first introduction. I want to get my picture up as an avatar at some point. I would be happy to help you no matter what your skill level. Please do pardon me as I don’t know the forum etiquette this is actually my first introduction. I want to get my picture up as an avatar at some point.

If I am in the wrong place I do apologize please steer me to the right place so I could have the right group, and help the right person.

Thanks
Mario Leone

 

I just want a good template for a zelda like RPG "repeated" story formula about a black princess that avoid all the paradoxical trapping of writing dark skin black women, so I have more time adapting to gameplay rather than thinking twist and turn. I have been struggling with a good generic ending and starting point that feel good enough relatives to said trapping especially relative to a free roaming structure where you can visit everywhere at any time. Currently I have something loosely inspired by the dahomey amazon meet shadow of war (liberate stronghold from the ice queen commander and minion, by rallying rebel of each area) but I need an intro that feel like more disney princess than xena (due to the sapphire trope). I have been looking at anime to get the right tone (feminine cute heroin that still has a lot of agency), it's just the beginning I need to nail mostly, how do I set the stakes and the tone. Everything is probably already there, I just miss the Aha, that make them fall into place.

 

Do your best to fill these in....

In a world where___
A character discovers he/she/they have______
has the power to go on a ________ journey
and if they succeed they will ______
and if not they will _________?

Fill in the blanks. This will help you create not only the world but the characters/group journey.

What is character goal?
Emotional tone? Dystopian?

Stakes...

• What Will the hero ‍♂️ stand to lose through conflict?
• What do they gain?
• What is their obsession or need to obtain or achieve, and what stands in the way of them doing this?
• What are they risking in trying to achieve their objective?
  
• What are the character aversions?
  
• Stakes are raised as they achieve different levels....
  
• Stakes must emotionally connect to the character and be important
• Stakes can be global
• Stakes are Personal
• It has to be important to them.
• Character can’t walk away.
• Willing to make sacrifices even desperation.

 

Yeah the question are obvious that's the answer that bother me lol

Any story is easy
the one right story is hard

 

Ask a better quality question and you’ll get a better quality answer. In other words, maybe if you rephrase the question in different ways you may find the answers you’re looking for. You don’t want to force anything. Sometimes things will just come out. When you’re going for ideas it’s best to temporarily suspend all judgment and get as many ideas as you can out. Go for an abundance of ideas. Then cross some of them out and try to combine two or three. See good ideas are sometimes the blend of multiple ideas.

It’s best for you to reflect on these.

Because in essence if you’re expecting an answer right away sometimes it comes out and sometimes it takes days. That’s the reality. But feel free to keep asking the question. Because the more you ask the question the more you stimulate the mind. Then bang like a firecracker all the sudden it pops in your head and you’ve got to write it down.

Whenever you hit a brick wall go do something entirely different. Turn your mental thinking towards doing something completely different.

Could be exercising reading a book, or whatever. Sometimes when we try to force it, it doesn’t come out. When your mind relaxes then suddenly you’ll be lightning struck with an amazing idea. Keep going and don’t quit ever.Whenever you hit a brick wall go do something entirely different.

Ask the questions to yourself in a quiet place over and over again and just write down more than one idea. Then see if you could combine multiple ideas together. Go for quantity. Then distillate down to quality. Sometimes people want to get perfection immediately they don’t realize that to have something of quality and entertainment takes time and refinement. This is why we have software versions. Versions one point one or two point two. Because it’s a constant process. So are your good ideas...

 

You are right, that generally worked, I have notebook full of idea, 400p just that one story, many more for different ideas, If I nail the concepts, I'll have plenty bullets forever.

But this specific problems really outline that there is a difference between being creatives, ie being sensible in how you approach things, it's all permutation. And being a creators, ie being sensitive, having "something to say". A lot of good story are kinda wonky in terms of structure, but what matter is that they have a core that resonate with people, and you need to find that resonance.

Truth is, I didn't expected that trying a "simple" story in the like of nintendo, who doesn't have deep character mind you, but for a specific audience, would be so hard, because it's all about distilling a feeling to it's minimalist simplest shape, that's hard. Especially when you realize there is a difference between pleasing an audience, and caring for it, and this need care.

I guess I asked for help because I expected a tie breaker, your question focus on structure or posture as a writer, they are great if you are a professional on a deadline, very motivational. I probably need someone who have new horizon to nudge me toward, as I feel I'm stuck into my own universe, and thus can't cross toward a solution.

But more importantly, you didn't gave advice you started with the specific seed I shared, you didn't ask about the core of what I was trying to tell, because ultimately, before structural question, the important one is "why do we write, what do we want to tell, what are the selected elements tell us about that core, why do we care about that story", that's the one thing we should know, the tie breaker, at least we are in creator. And some time we need external gaze, who is right or wrong it doesn't matter, it just need to makes us realize what's there all along, the core of the story, then we can answer the structural question.

I too help people making sense of their own story, I have been successful here and in other forums. It's just 'The shoemaker always wears the worst shoes'.

 

Sounds like you're talking about a theme. There are lots of articles on the internet about identifying a them in a work of literature. One approach might be to apply this exercise to what you've written so far. Assume that you have a theme already, even if you haven't quite identified what it is yet. Then, once you've identified the theme, that will inform your decisions for plot details.

 

It's deeper than a theme, all these story lingo start when you have the core of what you want to express. For example one thing that is really important is hair rendering of character, it's not really about the theme or the story per see, but it's part of the "caring" part of what to say. If I mess that up, it would cheapen everything else.

But I'm more specifically looking for example of "start up" that would match the target tone in the target structure. It's very specific, as in I know how these story starts in general, but I can't seem to find a variant that fit that particular story.

Because like I said the story itself is rather simple:
- it's a (black) princess who try to regain her kingdom (fyjo) from an alien invader (the ice queen), city by city in any order, while avoiding the trope of the sapphire, and more akin to some anime heroine (ie sensitive, cute and feminine not quite but think ghibli or nadia, or anty in utena as "presentation" or even sailor moon).

Generally these story start a bit "gung ho" (ie not the wisecracking bad ass hero) but I want something more akin of disney princess (but they are too passive for such a story). And it's must work as a game opening.

I have been trying to find opening that are similar as a function (ie set up similar tone), to fast track.

I basically have all the answer, I probably don't have all the question.

 

I can finger point the direction, and guide people, and in terms of writing a story for them that is a different plan. It’s one thing to just hand you the answers, and it’s another to get you to think in a different direction and get you unstuck. That is my goal. To get you unstuck. We are often our own creative block standing in our own way. The questions beg to be answered, and again and again. I provided you with questions that you should probably answer more than once. While I might’ve answered a question with a question,and that was to get you to think in a different direction. Overall my intentions are good.

 

The target tone in the target structure. Hmmmm.

I want you to think of the tone or target tone and the feeling of the game atmosphere you are trying to create. Not necessarily the mood that’s the emotion that you actually get. I want you to think of the feeling of the atmosphere that you are trying to create. Try to think visually, and see your screen in terms of how color is used in order to create an environment that invokes a particular feeling. I believe if my memory serves Jet Li Hero, when each landscape was a different color and gave the audience a different feeling or tone. The tone is the feeling from the atmosphere that you the storyteller has set into the story. The mood is what you get from that atmosphere. It’s kind a like going to a dark restaurant there is a certain tone to the environment. There might be a more hip jazzy environment that provides a fun tone. Take a look at Grimm fandango the video game. It is the land of the dead, and has this Mexican land of the dead culture embedded in within this beetle juice type world.

What is the starting point of where are you find your main character? Do you find them in a room full of blood, and they’re unable to explain how they got there? Memory loss? The overall tone can be a dark tone, and a dystopian, or perhaps even cyber punk? The tone of things can be lighthearted, and fun. It is very important that we separate theme from tone here. So a good question would be what’s the first thing they see when they kick off the beginning of their journey? What is the atmosphere and what is the feeling that the audience would get from that particular atmosphere?

 

No carbon rules
Doesnt mean there is no scenario studies and such ( I did when i was an art student )
But basically i'd say

-Take risks and make many stories and see what ones reaches the most
Taking risk might pay off and make your story stands out a bit
Making small little stories is a good exercise to point out what your audience might love and wants from you

But in any case, do many and you'll get better with time, make a lot
If your first story have some characters you love but nobody loves it and your last one you made get some success with a bucnh of characters you dont much love you can do a replacement of characters and such
Putting your first characters in that last story

Or too simply keep the same characters and lore, up to you

But the core advice is to make many, very short stories and you'll progress there

For what most popular stories question, i dunno
I'll let others responds to that better

My 2cents

 

I would probably refine my own ideas here...
Read a lot of stories, and write a lot of stories. If you can’t write a lot spend time reading Screenplays they’re all over the Internet. You can read it from start to finish and understand the cinematics used.

 

I agree, yes
Reading a lot and get inspired and guided by good short stories will definitly Help
And with the time he will get his own style ready for the audiences.

 

Agreed.

 

I wasn't sure if I should answer to that lol
Those advice pretend to sell the soda, but really are selling the bottle, I don't want the bottle, I want the soda, sure the bottle can get any content, and there is a relation between its shape and the content, but it's by convention rather than nature.

I write story since I'm a kid, I'm sure you all do. I know my vladimir propp, my hero's journey, I have the mckee books, I used Dramatica, I understand the greimassian model, and I have my own extension of it for game purpose, I read even meta analysis like Bruno Bettelheim about tales, I like surf TvTropes and have endless discussion of the use of character or pop character. Heck I was even hired to work Procedural story generation once ...

I ask my question in such a way to see how one would engage in that idea of writing story, I was surprise by the deafness. When I help people I engage with the content of what they try to say, the soda, then once the soda has the taste, you get to select the right bottle. You can't help people writing without engaging with the content they want to express. This content itself can be the expression of various desire, if you want to feel clever, you create intricate structure or clever twist, therefore the content will need to find a subject that reflect that, to take a common example. I can't put make up on you if I can't see your face, I need to know what to enhance. See those nice cheeks, you might need some rosée if you want feel cute, or maybe add some shadow to feel serious and imposing.

We can't put structure if we don't know what's the purpose of the story, the very first advice SHOULD be to know why the story is written, what if the character is wrong, because you just copy a story you have seen, without understanding why thing are the way they are, story aren't formula to just applied. Else you'll write headless chicken like the star wars new trilogy. Help people find the meaning of their story THEN help them structure that meaning into a plot structure. I hope this is useful to someone, bye.

 

Is that this one?

 

I always use Quora first, here I found related topic https://www.quora.com/What-is-your-all-time-favorite-story-and-why

 

yeah

 

I would also like to add that it’s not always story, but how the story works alongside with interactions, and player or user triggers. I am noticing in the marketplace that story rich games are becoming more prominent.

 

So, just for the record I want to help people who actually need it. If you feel you don’t need help you can simply skip over me no problem. I do care to help people that are struggling with their story, level design, interactivity ideas, and more. Have a great day.