Stop the Disease on the forums, help make this a better place.

Hello All. Thanks for taking time to read this post, it is of great importance and will shape the future of our community.

First off, I would like to request that from no one when you come across a forum post, that you take time to talk to the person, gather information about the problem, and provide an exact solution to the issue at hand. These steps are key and vital to the prolonged success of the community.

The reason why I am seeking this reply from all, is because I have personally been at a problem for a year now and still have no success with solving it. After hours of videos, multiple chats with people in discord, looking through the codex, playing with Trails, Line Renders, etc I still have no solution to the issue. This is however, largely due to a few statements I have been getting which has opened me up to realizing that the community support here is really horrid, terrible, and down right arrogant at times.

The issue I am speaking about you are guilty of if you have made some sort of statement like

"you should try line render"
"you should try trail render"
"you should google for a solution"
"try youtube"
"please explain what your trying to do... Try a line render"


These statements are not solutions. They are vague answers, that do absolutely nothing to help a situation. You in effect are being jerks when you answer like this.

You need to step back a little, and look at a few key points.

1) a person coming here has failed to understand how to resolve the issue
2) repeating add this module, is not going to resolve the problem.
3) vague answers do absolutely nothing but waste your time, and the time of the person who is looking for help
4) Upsetting people beyond that point will just result in people giving up on unity and ultimately their project(s).


You need to answer in this format

- Include a direct solution. Even if you have to code it, Do it. Stop being greedy, or get off the forums. this is not a place for your ignorant so you can pretend to know what you are talking about when you have no clue.

- Do not use vague statements like "use line renderer"

- Remember that the person you are talking to is upset.

- give a walk through on how they need to implement your solution.

- follow up and ask if they need any help modifying it, or if its working as intended/desired.



This process will help make this an environment of learning, and fun. It is vital to the over all health of the community with those who are engaging hobbies or inspiring to do more.

 

It appears i have a new job...

You do realize that (except for Unity personnel) everyone here is helping out of kindness, giving away knowledge and time freely?
I have had some questions go unanswered, but i prefer to check how i formulated my question for a reason i didn't get a reply.
And otherwise it could be people don't know either
Anyway, i feel i have no special "right" at all to an answer and if i do get one, i feel sincere gratitude.
In general i feel this is a very responsive and generous community. I have learned a lot here and continue to do so.
You obviously feel different and you should perhaps consider Premium Support

 

Help, Does not come in the manner of "go try that thing you tried".
That is not help, that is trolling and arrogant debauchery.

 

I 100% see where you're coming from. I see how you think that what you've posted there is constructive. However, I implore you to see things from the other point of view.

When we give "vague" answers it isn't because we're trying to waste your time. I know it's hard to see that, I've been there myself. But it's simply not practical, and often not even possible, to "give a walk through on how [you] need to implement [my] solution" in most cases. Here's a bunch of reasons off the top of my head:

• People asking questions rarely give complete information. This isn't their fault - if they knew the complete set of relevant information they'd probably have solved the problem without our help in the first place - but it does mean that we can't solve their problem without first asking a bunch of questions.
• There are often no golden bullet answers. In many cases literally the best we can do is lay out some options and give some pros and cons and bounce the ball back to the person asking the question. We don't know your project, or your abilities/knowledge/skill, as well as you do. It's not that we don't want to help, it's that we're simply often not in a position to make a meaningful suggestion of one right answer. The best we can do is try to equip you to make that choice yourself.
• We simply don't have time. I do answer questions in a manner pretty similar to what you're demanding there... when I'm working as a professional on the clock. That's not actually because of the money aspect, it's because if you're paying me then I'm going to spend my time how you want. If you're not paying me then you're one of many, many priorities I'm juggling at any one time. I flat out do not have time to answer even one question a month with the degree of detail you're demanding there.
  
• It's not our job to make your game for you. And whether you realise it or not, that's pretty much what you're telling us we should be doing. Stop working on our stuff because you have a problem, spend the time to understand your project in such fine detail that we can write you step by step instructions including code, and then hang around afterwards in case you need still more help.
  
  Will you stop what you're doing and write some code for my game? For free? Please?

I could carry on with a point-by-point explanation of why what you're asking for isn't practical, but I won't because I'm sure the point is clear by now. If someone gives you even a short answer then please keep in mind that they've already spent some of their own time reading your problem, digesting and understanding it, considering whether they can help in any way, and then writing you a response. They have volunteered to help you and, hopefully, the community as a whole by sharing their knowledge and experience.

In your post there, you're responding to people trying to help you and others by telling them that they're unhelpful, greedy, lazy, arrogant and debauched. I'm pretty sure that's not the message you're trying to send, but it's the one that's coming across.


Here's the really important thing, though: The main skill in game development is problem solving. You can not rely on us to do that for you. If you can't pick that skill up for yourself then we literally can't help you no matter how much we try. We'll point you in the right direction, we'll explain the gaps in your knowledge, we'll tell you what's worked for us.

But we can't fill those gaps for you, we can't learn for you, and we can't hand you our experience on a golden platter. It's not that we don't want to, it's that those things aren't possible!

Most especially, we can not teach you problem solving by handing you ready-made solutions.


To put this in context, it took me ~10 years of more-than-full-time game development after 3.5 years of dedicated study after years of tinkering as a kid to get to the point where I am now. I share as much of that experience and knowledge as I reasonably can, and I understand why you're asking for what you're asking for. But I simply can't blurt an experience potion out through my keyboard. I would if I could, but I can't.

Read the article linked in my signature. Ask specific questions. Learn all you can. Build games, and - above all else - focus on building your problem solving skills.

 

Spoiler: Adults Only

 

If that your was a you're, I don't see how that is not a reasonable response. If the question does not have enough information, asking the poster to tell us more about his issue is absolutely necessary. It's not trivial to give a helpful answer to someone without first fully understanding the issue, but your post seems to imply that people respond vaguely out of spite or something.

Greedy? How is someone not wanting to code a full solution for someone else, greedy?

We're all equals here. People have a varying amounts of knowledge in various areas and it's nice that we can help each other on here. But no one has an obligation to help another and everyone's time is limited. Problem solving is a major part of gamedev and people do it for their own projects a lot. Expecting they do it for other people as well is not reasonable. Plus, usually, a list of things that need to be looked into is usually enough for someone to figure out the solution.

Plus, even "unhelpful" vague answers may point in the right direction and even if they don't, they are at the very least useful to rule things out, make the issue more understandable, so someone else can figure out the correct answer. Plus they bump the thread back on top so someone else might see it.

 

@hippo,

To funny

 

You need to ask questions in this format

- Use code tags properly. I can't believe we still need to tell people this with the thread for it stickied at the very top of the Scripting forum section, but that appears to be the case with practically every new thread now including some of your very own posts.

- Provide relevant information. If you are getting an error message from Unity in the console that you need assistance with then you at least need to provide that error message and provide it in text format. Screenshots are obnoxious and completely pointless because the information needs to be in text format to use.

Additionally keep in mind

- Remember that we have an actual life beyond assisting you. We need to work to support ourselves, our families, pay our bills, and so on. After everything in our lives is taken care of most of us only have a meager amount of free time and we're using that free time to assist you.

- Don't expect us to solve every step of the problem for you. The proverb Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish, and you feed him for a lifetime. is very relevant here. Simply handing you a solution won't teach you anything.

Finally

- Assist others. You may find some of us are more willing to assist you if you show a willingness to assist others. Your post history shows that you have been here over a year, requested help multiple times, but have not assisted anyone else with their problems. Who is the greedy one here again?

 

I'm not posting this to ridicule or insult you. But I sincerely believe that reading this might be helpful to you, if you constantly having trouble in getting good answers from people:

• https://opensource.com/life/16/10/how-ask-technical-questions
  
• http://www.catb.org/esr/faqs/smart-questions.html

 

Taking a look at ops post history, the common thread is angry, demanding, rude.

 

Spoiler: Sense of humor required

* taps foot waiting for post deletion *

 

Are you expecting this from paid Unity staff members or from unpaid peers in the forum? The vast majority of the people on this forum are unpaid peers with busy lives and projects of their own. You cannot expect us (unpaid peers) to write code for you and give you step by step assistance integrating code into your project.

And honestly, your request is a bit much even for paid Unity staff. It is not Unity staff's responsibility to help you code your game. Unity staff should strive to make things as easy as possible for new users, including making massive improvements to documentation (API docs are admittedly hit or miss at times). But Unity staff cannot be responsible for developing custom code for your project and then giving you detailed step by step help integrating that custom code into your project. At some point, you (as a game dev) needs to accept responsibility for building your game.

I did not read through your other threads, so I cannot comment on the specifics of the help or lack of help you received. You definitely cannot hold unpaid peers responsible, though. If somebody was outright rude, that is cause to say something, but don't expect strangers on a forum to write your code for you. That is not how game development works.

 

I took the time to read through your existing threads to get a better idea what you were complaining about in this thread. You definitely believe strangers should both provide code for you and then help you integrate it into your project. That is definitely not a fair request to make of other people in a forum. In some of your threads, you literally found free code in YouTube videos, failed to get it to work in your project, and then got mad at unpaid peers in the forum for not doing more to help you. And in some cases, those unpaid peers even gave you more free code to try to help you. Wow.

Moving forward, I strongly recommend that you start with the basics and practice building a few small, simple games to practice some of the basic skills. Don't blame others. Start small and really learn the basics, and then build more complex games once you feel confident in your coding skills.

 

There are several people who will provide code, and pretty extensive help. That is awesome that they do, and should be commended for their assistance, but it should not be expected. That is people going above and beyond and being really helpful.

The other posts have covered things very well, ask good questions, be an active participant and part of the community and don't make demands on what others should and shouldn't do. You will get great help here if are respectful of others and pay attention to what they are saying.

 

Sometimes I wonder if amount of help people provide is a "disease" that prevents others learning how to help themselves / do their own homework / owning their own problems. This thread seems "diseased" in that respect, to me.

In the short time I have actively participated with these fora several thread OPs have even gone so far as to state like "I could google this but my time is too valuable so I thought I'd ask people to do a bunch of work for me"

From what I've seen the people going out of there way to try and help others are not the problem, it's people that abuse the ability to request help and don't appreciate the time, grace or efforts of others.

 

No real need for me to chime in here, but I'm bored, so...

I looked through your (OP) post history, and it appears as if you are asking (demanding) help for every single aspect of the game you are making. Movement code, graphics code, camera code, effects code. And then each of those threads has you in them somewhere berating people for not "helping".

We're not here to write your game for you. In truth, you don't appear to possess a true game developer mind set. Game development requires critical thinking skills, creative and sometimes extreme problem solving, a DIY sensibility, and above all else, patience. Lots and lots of patience. You might want to reconsider whether you are cut out for this hobby/career in the first place. Not everyone is.

 

In conclusion:

• We're not here to code a game for you.
• People might jump in from time to time and help you out by giving you free code, but don't expect that to happen all the time. How to implement or modify given code is, too, your job.
• We can give you advice (yes, "you should try line render" is one), but if you need more of an advanced help, Unity Connect might be the right place.
• Most importantly: don't be a dick. Be nice. Ask better questions with helpful information, so that people can help you better.

 

Actually, its all Unity's fault, they haven't implemented that "Create Prefect Game" button which we've been requesting for so long... It sucks, but I guess we'll have to learn to code ourselves

 

Because you have to meet people half way, and provide enough data for your problem to be understandable, then be able to apply basic problem solving skills with the data that is returned to you. If someone does all the work for you that is a massive disservice to you and enables you to continue on while not learning basic problem solving skills and relevant game development skills.

Now if you just want someone to make a game for you, this is not the place to ask, but i am sure that if your pockets are deep enough that can happen as well. But even then, any good studio or contractor will demand that you put the effort and time in to write a proper GDD and SOW with a clear scope.

edit: just looked at your past threads, you get more with sugar then S***, maybe not approach things by being actively hostile.

 

I'll consult, research and write those things for someone if they're willing to cover my time during the process. The important thing is communication in both directions along the way. They need to be able to communicate what they want, or answer questions, and they need to listen and pay attention to what I'm saying and doing otherwise they've no idea what they're signing off at the end.

 

So, you've been stumped with a problem for over a year. And you expect somebody here to solve it for free?

 

Have you ever stepped off your throne of arrogance and consider that you may be aproaching problem the wrong way or asking the wrong question?

Maybe it's time to let it go?
Have you tried line render yet?

 

exactly you have to be met half way, if a client does not do that then it turns into a zero sum game and is not worth the time.

 

It must be a joke.

 

This thread has to be satire.
There is no way someone this entitled has considered a development hobby/career, right?

 

I think everyone here misunderstands the guy

He's trying to show us a satirical view of how some members sometimes act.
A humorous reflection of a few rare bad apples here.

I think we should all applaud him for capturing the essence of that behavior so well.

Personally I wouldn't even go as far as calling him a 'troll' since I think the connotation is that the person wants to do something negative / hurt someone / ...

Hilarious, great job man - made me laugh.

Hm, there's a tiny chance that OP is just a child and will learn in time (after all, with a mindset like that they'll get into trouble really quickly - which should straighten them out)

tl;dr: relax everyone, you'd be perfectly right if they're for real! But I doubt they really mean it.

 

@dadude123 is what I though as well. But now look at his post history.

 

Whew. now that you mentioned it I've taken a look.

Reading this post history feels like I just got kicked face by mean realization.
If the behavior on the these forums is any indication for their behavior in real life, then I wonder how they're not already in jail or something haha.

Anyway, they'll learn eventually, one way or another.

 

Why do you think it's not a harshly moderated topic, the OP has brought it all on himself, and sometimes that's a pretty good lesson in itself.

 

Nah, it doesn't look like an agressor personality, more of a manipulator.

 

I wonder... maybe it's a time we should lock this thread?