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Unity SRP Rendering API Survey

Discussion in 'General Graphics' started by ali_mohebali, Jan 5, 2021.

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  1. ali_mohebali

    ali_mohebali

    Unity Technologies

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2020
    Posts:
    57
    Hi everyone,

    Happy new year! As part of improving SRP Rendering APIs we are running a survey to understand your use cases for various API classes and methods. We would appreciate your feedback as it helps us improve performance and usability of the existing APIs and provide new APIs that currently don't cover your needed use cases.

    We will be running this survey for the next 15 days.

    As a side note, this survey should take around 25 minutes to complete and needs to be taken on a desktop. The survey questions do not display correctly on mobile devices.

    https://unitysoftware.co1.qualtrics.com/jfe/form/SV_2geDsV9dhvypIkR?Channel=FRM

    Appreciate your time in advance,
    Cheers!
     
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2021
    GliderGuy, t_tutiya, landonth and 2 others like this.
  2. Carwashh

    Carwashh

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2012
    Posts:
    602
    Is it ok to share this survey outside of this forum? I'm in the UK Games Industry slack.. we have a Unity channel that many in may want to complete the survey.
     
    ali_mohebali likes this.
  3. ali_mohebali

    ali_mohebali

    Unity Technologies

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2020
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    Absolutely! Would appreciate it. Please feel free to share it.
     
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  4. tatoforever

    tatoforever

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Posts:
    4,089
    Starting the survey.
    Thanks for hearing us out.
    PS: I will share it on social media.
    [EDIT] Done and also shared on my social sites.
    Feel free to contact me if you need additional input or feedback.
     
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2021
    ali_mohebali likes this.
  5. BattleAngelAlita

    BattleAngelAlita

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2016
    Posts:
    373
    This survey design is an insanely terrible.
    Cmon guys, you know what we want: render with shader, proper shader fallback, multipass, acess to culling and per renderer data, feature parity for RenderTexture and RenderTargetIndetifier
     
  6. slime73

    slime73

    Joined:
    May 14, 2017
    Posts:
    70
    I was able to use the Custom Pass API to easily replace those in the situations my project used them - with the former, the Custom Pass API ended up suiting my needs much better than the old RenderWithShader, too. Maybe your use cases are different than mine though (in which case it'd be better to discuss use cases than the old solution for those use cases).
     
  7. BattleAngelAlita

    BattleAngelAlita

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    Last edited: Jan 6, 2021
  8. KrisDevelopment

    KrisDevelopment

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2015
    Posts:
    27
    Thank you for making this survey.
    My input was mostly complaining about SRP promoting shader graph and lacking a more programmer-friendly support for optimization and workflow reasons. Doing shaders in SRP is really slower than writing it in code tbh. I've tried porting BRP to SRP shaders and it's something really time-consuming.
    * EDIT * if there are resources on SRP coding, please excuse my ignorance on the matter. I have not been able to find them.
     
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  9. ali_mohebali

    ali_mohebali

    Unity Technologies

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2020
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    There is a field in the survey asking about any other APIs that you would like to be added that currently don’t cover your use cases. Could you please fill up the details in the field with your use cases there. Use cases would be super useful (like the one you explained for replaceShader). Easier to collect and compile all the feedbacks in one place using the survey.
     
    t_tutiya likes this.
  10. ali_mohebali

    ali_mohebali

    Unity Technologies

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2020
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    No worries! We will have a look. I will also plan for a survey/feedback collection specifically relevant to that topic. This survey was mostly on the APIs side of things.
     
  11. tatoforever

    tatoforever

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Posts:
    4,089
    @ali_mohebali,
    Also we would like to have news about the public Graphics repo, the reason why it was archived/set to private and if it has something to do with new changes to SRPs?
    This move by Unity really made me fear about investing more time on SRP, I have assets being ported to URP and HDRP and it requires sources changes to both renderers but I fear of wasting my time, once again.
     
  12. ali_mohebali

    ali_mohebali

    Unity Technologies

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2020
    Posts:
    57
    Thank you for taking the time on filling up the survey and sharing it as well. Appreciate it. Did you put your contact details at the end of the form for being contacted later? Otherwise I will take a note and add your name to the list.

    I hear your concerns and frustrations. We will have an update soon. It is top of our priorities to rectify the ambiguity soon. Please give us a bit of time to post the update.
     
    GliderGuy and t_tutiya like this.
  13. tatoforever

    tatoforever

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    Apr 16, 2009
    Posts:
    4,089
    Yes, my email and asked to be contacted for further questions or feedbacks.

    Thankyou.
     
    ali_mohebali likes this.
  14. TwiiK

    TwiiK

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2007
    Posts:
    1,699
    Been using Unity since version 2.x and I have no idea what most of the questions referred to, but I chose "No" to the question of whether I would switch to the SRP's in the future. Checkmate, I guess?

    Either way, I won't use the SRP's until built-in is actually removed and replaced by the SRP's and by that time I hope you have figured out this mess.
     
  15. Rastapastor

    Rastapastor

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2013
    Posts:
    162
    Unify teams that work on SRP, put a proper abstraction layer on top and don't break everything every release :)....just from the super noob user perspective. Its kinda annoying that shaders are not intersrp, keeping stuff with URP HDRP and atm built in is annoying, especially when tehre are a lot of breaking changes between versions.
     
  16. HarryPigskin

    HarryPigskin

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2021
    Posts:
    6
    Not strictly SRP, but not possible because of the way things are handled in SRP.
    What recently I tried to do this outline effect:
    jmpebLisjY.gif
    Setting up one camera to be the main renderer, the base camera, and the outline to be the overlay camera.

    The issue is I want my overlay camera to manipulate an independent render texture, but my understanding of the base/overlay system is that both the base camera and the overlay cameras use the same render target, so when my outline shader blurs the screen, zeros out pixels, etc, it ruins my main render.

    If in future it could be possible to make a setting which allows Overlay cameras render to their own RenderTexture, rather than straight to the main camera, then to apply that render to the main camera after the pieline is done, that would be very useful to me. Maybe default the background to new Color(0,0,0,0) instead of skybox when changing the setting to stop potential issues when using independent rendering.

    My current workaround is to turn the Overlay camera into a base camera with a lower render order, apply it's texture to a render texture, then apply that texture to the main camera with an "Overlay" RenderFeature which I've written myself.
    Although that feels a little silly since there's already an overlay system within the engine.


    All the best,
    Harry.

    [EDIT: It seems in working on this problem for very long I've missed something quite basic.
    Instead of being a limitation of the Overlay System I may have instead found a bug in the BaseCamera system.

    Since BaseCameras have priorities, if this allowed you to overlay Base Cameras in the way I'm describing without using any overlay cameras, then I retract my suggestion due to it having no purpose.

    As Unity is in 2021.1.0b1 though, only one Base Camera can render to the screen at a time and that is the BaseCamera with the highest priority. It may be something just isolated to this version, I have not checked.

    Seasons Greetings,
    Harry]
     
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2021
  17. ali_mohebali

    ali_mohebali

    Unity Technologies

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2020
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    @HarryPigskin you should be able to do what you are explaining (if I am understanding it correctly). Workflows are different in URP and HDRP and also compared to built-in. We admittedly need better documentation and more guidelines and examples to help you out. And we are working on it. This survey also helps us understand if we are lacking apis, whether we should improve existing ones based on the use cases or should we simply provide more documentation and guidelines. Just to give you a bit of hint, for example if you are using URP you can do what you are explaining without a need for overlay camera:
    1. create a scriptable renderer feature, add a ScriptableRenderPass with appropriate RenderPassEvent, probably before or after post processing passes
    2. Renderer outline into a temp render target (Look into ScriptableRenderPass.CameraSetup, ScriptableRenderPass.ConfigureInput and CommandBuffer.GetTemporaryRT and ScriptableRenderPass.Executre methods)
    3. Using the camera main target as destination target, blur the temp outline render target
    Feel free to DM me, would be happy to understand your case better and take your feedback.
     
    t_tutiya likes this.
  18. ali_mohebali

    ali_mohebali

    Unity Technologies

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2020
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    Thanks everyone for participating in this survey. We are concluding this survey today.

    We are super happy that we have received a lot responses from you all. We will start processing and digesting the feedback in the coming days. For those who have opted in to be contacted for providing more details, we will get in touch.

    Thank you again for being active and providing feedback to us. It has and will help us improve SRPs along the way and make sure it addresses the concerns or issues you are facing.
     
    t_tutiya likes this.
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