Realtime GI System - Indirect Ilumination (WIP)

I'm waiting anxiously for it!
Also i read somewhere that cryengine is making fake GI, is that true?

 

Hi Almaj,
I'm not using the exact same method like crytek... it's similar. Well the phrase "fake GI" can be interpreted differently. For me "fake GI" is putting some extra lights, like point or spot lights, together to fake the indirect illumination, that is not what I'm approaching here... In another way e.g. mental ray in combination with final gather could also be named "fake GI" because it is not 100% physical correct. In my opinion, the important thing is it should look realistic and it can be used fully dynamic, that means you could exchange the whole scene with another one in realtime and always get the fitting indirect lighting. By the way, I was working in the film industry, making cgi/effects for hollywood movies, for some time and believe me, no one in this business has the time to render a physical correct image, everything is an approximation, it is the job of the artist to make it feel real.

 

Tanks CKahler for your great explanation, it's true, in cryengine 3 sometimes i need to add some negative lights in some areas to have a more depth feeling, so lets say that cryengine have Semi-GI right?
and how about color bleeding, can it be done dynamically with your method?

Again tanks for your amazing work.

 

Here is my new demo:

[video=youtube_share;xyxmDWUTqpw]http://youtu.be/xyxmDWUTqpw


And the download link for the standalone (DX11 only!): https://skydrive.live.com/redir?resid=AC03435B5F8329C8!110

Runs with 90-100 FPS on my GTX 770 (1280 x 1024), this video was captured with 60 FPS.

ToDos:
- insert occlusion ( stops color bleeding through geometry )
- add virtual point lights for sky GI
- add point- and spot lights to GI
- add reflections
- improve speed

Known Bugs:
- flickering with the character camera
- flickering on slow GPUs
- sun stucks when it is set to low

Greets,
Chris

 

Hi
look really cool. Thanks for the demo.
I would like to buy it when I am back from holidays in 3 weeks for my next project.

Wish you a successful development.

All the best
Joerg

 

Hi Chris, I tried the demo. That's amazing! Great work. It's very strange for me to suddenly get reacquainted with real-time global illumination; it feels like the cryEngine all over again!

All joking aside, if you can get this thing to run rock-solid and to support already-existing shaders (POM, tessellation, fur...) then this is a sure buy from me.

To give you a little feedback, I noticed that there's indeed very heavy flickering the further away you move the camera (my graphics card is a GTX Titan). It looks almost like a shadow bias problem...



Again, excellent job! I hope you can implement your feature list and fix all the bugs because I'd be definitely willing to use this tech for "Ghost of a Tale"...

 

Thanks for the feedback, but thats the unity shadow maps flickering, nothing to do with my system. (Maybe the bias must be higher). If you turn of the Indirect Illumination in the Helper Menu (F1) it should be visible, too.

Besides, I uploaded the same demo with the Color Space "Gamma". It has a bit more contrast:

https://skydrive.live.com/redir?resid=AC03435B5F8329C8!111

 

Yes, I can confirm it's just Unity shadow bias settings; nothing to do with your GI system...

I just tried the gamma demo and to keep on with the feedback: I noticed that when a colored sphere is just at the edge (outside) of the camera frustum it does not contribute at all to GI. But when I turn the camera just a little bit then the area that was completely dark suddenly lights up in a very noticeable manner (see picture).

Do you think there could there be a way of alleviating this effect by widening a little the area that gets taken into account for the GI effect? I hope you see what I mean...

 

Hi CKahler, thank you for the demo.
However, i see some hard unnatural darkening of the light when i am close to the surface ( GTX680, driver 320.18 ). Are you using some eye adaptation post process? Because sky is darker and GI light is gone ?
There are two screens with slight rotated camera view.



I guess it happen because GI is calculated always in view frustum, but if strong indirect light come from outside it didn't take it into calculations? Should it be corrected by increasing offset GI frustum matrix by few degrees?

 

Thanks for the feedback guys, I will experiment with the view frustum matrix. And yes, I'm using some post process effects that could darken the screen.

 

Not a bad demo... now if the man standing on top of this structure was skinned, I will be very impressed

 

Well, the character is a skinned animated character as far as I can see (you can control him by pressing "X" and then the usual WASD control keys)...

 

It actually works pretty well running on a GTX 460

So right now it uses one light for the sun, how many lights will it be able to support? What about emissive materials?

 

Really cool demo, im running it in a GT 660 and works very well, just i have a problem whit the sun, i always have a sunset, i cant raise the sun, to be like in morning or the middle of the day. is really good that your system works with skinned models

 

Beautiful! Modest performance on an Alienware M17x with a 2gig 580m at 1080p, and slightly better at 720p obviously.

I'd have to play with settings to get better performance but I did notice one interesting thing...

...if I turned the GI solution OFF the performance was exactly the same, which I suspect is a good thing!

Can't wait to play with this honestly...yay!!

-Steve

 

Looks pretty good. While I would like to try sponza (or bootcamp) with many settings
Pleased that you have taken precisely this sky (my favorite), but the water is not as good as the looks here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AVh1x-Uqjs (This is of course just nitpicking


I have noticed such problems (in addition to other listed):
1. I see a noticeable delay rendering of indirect light on the character (when an animation).

2. If you right-click will turn on infinite animation and characters can not be controlled.
3. When you switch to a character is not hiding the mouse cursor (C key does not work), and the camera can be rotated only when the cursor is near the edges of the window. It is not very convenient.
4. For some reason there is a delay (input lag) when rotating camera/mouse look (he is, even when indirect lighting is switched off and the lowest graphics settings). Clearly visible at high resolutions. Too high/wrong parameters Smooth Mouse Look?
5. Why is there no FPS counter?

You can then make a demo with materials similar like done here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ygZCDoCVec&feature=player_detailpage#t=232 (3:52)

 

Hi EvilFox,
I build this demo in one day and it is not perfect, it should give you a first impression of my gi system, which is not final yet. There will be a sponza and bootcamp demo, but I started with this because I like to show you how the new gi system can scatter light through this caved structures which, I think, looks amazing. Any other parts of the demo like fps or some other performance issues are not so important for the intended purpose. You can use fraps (download the free demo version) and run it with my demo, than you can see the fps count (don't record it, just run it). Thanks for the feedback, I know the delay problem and I will fix it at some point. What hardware do you have? I noticed this delay happens on slower machines more often, because the time between camera update and lighting update takes too long.

 

Hi. I see. Do not take me too seriously
I know about fraps, just convenient when it is in the demo.
I did not expect a great performance here, but somehow strange to see when the lighting at odds with the animation. Why did they go asynchronously? This is noticeable even at 40fps.

GTX 550 Ti
Driver version: 314.07

I made ​​a few tests:
1280х720@Fastest ~40-45
1600х900@Fastest ~30
1920х1080@Fastest ~21-24
2560х1440@Fastest ~14

1280х720@Good ~38-41
1600х900@Good ~28-30
1920х1080@Good ~20-22
2560х1440@Good ~13

1280х720@Fantastic ~21-30
1600х900@Fantastic ~19-20
1920х1080@Fantastic ~16
2560х1440@Fantastic ~10

640x480@Fastest ~69-74
640x480@Fantastic ~30-36
2560х1440@Beatiful ~12-13

All modes in full screen.

When off indirect lighting adds quite a bit of frames. It's strange, the feeling that something is continues to spend performance.

About input delay, I have not yet figured out. Probably due to a low FPS. But it seems that the delay in the bootcamp less (I set the effects of ultra-high settings for reduce FPS). I'd rather wait for the new demo

 

Hi EvilFox, thanks for the detailed reply, I keep on with improving

 

On driver version 320.49 nothing has changed.

Hi CKahler, Don't mention it.
How soon do you think to release the first version in assets store?
I am by no means a hurry you. Just curious.

 

Good news! I fixed all lighting issues, the lightmatrix wasn't focusing on the right spot! Fuzzy occlusion shadows (indirect shadows) are also working now! I also increased the performance a bit. I will update the demo tomorrow and add a new one!

Hopefully this week, and death sure this month!

 

Cool! I look forward to the new demos.

 

Yes! Sounds exciting!!

 

Don't rush it

 

Please rush it

 

That sounds awesome! What sort of requirenments will it have for our games? Unity Pro? Special Shaders? That sort of thing.

 

I already asked that question twice but never got an answer. Maybe there's a problem with that...

 

I also think 200 is a bit much. Yes, if its practical and has good performance, it will be worth that, but not many people would be able to pay that. Therefore less people will own it(less word of mouth), and you will probably make less over all. I would recommend the 100 dollar range, you will make more, and more people will own it and hopefully, love it and spread the word.

 

Fuzzy occlusion shadows? Sounds good. You have good ideas to surprise me. Is that techniques capable to replace SSAO?
I guess no reflections yet? My wish is to have access for source code editing to really experiment and tweak everything.

 

requirenments:
- Yeah unity pro because of the render to texture feature, (however i was thinking about writing a render to texture plugin in the future.)
- I'm trying to support all possible shaders ( unity and custom shaders), next demo I will test some more custom shaders.
Can't think of any other special requirenments right now.
The workflow will be quite easy: put the dynamic GI system in your project folder add lights which you want as GI sources and press the run button. voilà!

 

@Seith, CKahler already answered me. I am hoping for it to be true because, my shaders are already complex now.

There is the answer.

Nevertheless i do expecting some problems with custom shaders but anything i can not fix by myself to optimising for more standard light models.

 

Yes, it looks a bit like ssao you can compare it in the next demo.

It's coming just wait a few more days ;-)

I don't think it's to much for the quality you get, but at the beginning it will cost less.

 

I agree. I think it's worth it.
If you were able to buy Unity PRO, then I think $200 is not such a problem for that.

 

By the way I ran across this technique:

Modular Radiance Transfer

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQIOs6M8gyM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Kyj3NJ1pjQ

http://www.siliconstudio.co.jp/presentations/
http://zurich.disneyresearch.com/~wjarosz/publications/loos11modular.html
http://www.cs.utah.edu/~loos/publications/mrt/index.shtml

It looks fast.

What do you think about this?

<strike>I have a suspicion that it is used (improved) in tech demo "Agni's Philosophy", in Luminous Studio engine.</strike>
EDIT:
http://game.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/news/20111012_483045.html
http://game.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/news/20121129_575412.html

 

I am still trying to find out if it will be a safe bet to use with Skyshop. I built IBLs a lot with this tool and will definitely benefit from the strength of this tool...

 

If the asset is good as we expect I agree with you.

 

I'm watching closely

 

Good find!

 

Here is my new update of the demo:

Download demo: http://sdrv.ms/18Qkii4


@EvilFox: looks interesting, however when I get this right you need to build a low res model of your scene that is hidden and transfers the light information to the highres. That could be achieved with the lpv technique as well.

 

CKahler, why requesting administrative privileges? I had to run in a sandbox.

Performance has improved more than twice!
At 2560x1440@good — ~35-40 FPS if disabled post-effects and tessellation (IL IS AA on).
2560x1440@fantastic — ~24-28.
2560x1440@fastest — ~48-55.
1280x720@good — ~65-75.
1920x1080@good — ~46-57.
1920x1080@fantastic — ~27-33.

1920x1080@good:
52 — tesselation post-effects off.
22 — tesselation on.
18 — post-effects on.
12 — tesselation post-effects on.

The shadows are visible only at Fantastic, on the other modes, you can see them only if you really fly up close.

 

Nice, that runs much better than the old demo.

 

Wow what Evil said...

...performance is fantastic now (ON "Fantastic"!)

Same Alienware as my last post above:

1920x1080 / Fantastic / Indirect Light ON / Indirect Shadows ON / Adv. Approach ON = 36 FPS (I too disabled Post and Tess.)

Interestingly enough toggling only Indirect Lighting on/off only changes my framerate by 2 - 3 fps. Toggling Indirect Shadows and Adv. Approach takes another 2 - 3 FPS but thats it!

In total I go from the default scene without GI at 40 - 42 fps (1080p) to full GI at 36 - 38 fps...thats pretty goddamn phenomenal Chris!!

My Body is Ready

-Steve

 

Thank you guys, for the feedback!
The Bootcamp demo and a new demo with sky, spot, point lights and reflections is coming soon, after that I will release this beast ;-)

I only used Fantastic, never concerned about the other modes, because this demo is still not optimized to run on low end pcs.

 

Hi! amazing Demo but i have some problems, the demo always run about 12 to 15 frames,no matter if everything is on or everything is off, this in a GT450 mobile. and that is weird because with everything off, should run very fast.

 

Dat poll.

 

@Loards:yes, the demo is not optimized, it is just a visual preview! I'm still working on the performance!

here is the bootcamp demo with dynamic GI as promised:

 

In the video why are the really dark areas like a dark purple color? And is that green bounce lighting coming from the vegetation? Its pretty strong, but overall it looks fantastic!

 

This is an insta buy for me. Looking forward to the release, you are awesome

 

My shadow color is dark blue-purple. The tonemapping post effect enhances this too. the GI irradiance is a bit too strong! This is only a quick and dirty implementation. the green bounce lighting coming from the vegetation, the colors of the virtual point lights are oversaturated, this can be changed within the system.

 

Yea I'm getting color banding ranging from yellow-green to pinkish-orange in light, and serious burn-in from the dark purple. These feel more as if one were to push the contrast (in Photoshop lets say) too high, or artifacting from compression.

I've tried every possible configuration, with irradiance as low as 2 to 'soften' this. Otherwise I'd lose all other post-effects for now and focus on getting clean and predictable bounce and sky lighting.

Good news at least is that my performance is still fantastic.

Getting there!