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reaching 5000 impressions, all rewarded videos, 0.6$ eCPM really low

Discussion in 'Unity Ads' started by Dragonic89, Mar 31, 2016.

  1. Dragonic89

    Dragonic89

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    Hello,

    I will need some help from someone in the Unity staff to clarify why my app can't generate proper revenues with UnityAds for now ! There must be an error somewhere with Applifier !

    Video Started : 4929
    Video Completed : 4783
    Revenues : 3.02$


    This is clearly weird I think, for several reasons :
    - first because I only use rewarded videos in my game. The user choose to see the ads. This can only be better than skippable ads !
    - because 30% of videos are in Tiers 1 (17% Tiers 2, 39% Tiers 3). ~65% Android, 35% iOS
    - the 3.02$ comes from two punctual times (1.5$ and 1.52$). There is no revenue for everything else

    That's why I now need some help to clarify the problem behind this. 0.6$ eCPM is really too low ! And I don't want to start the promotional strategy of my game with this kind of context !

    EDIT : here is the link to the post with more details : http://forum.unity3d.com/threads/re...deos-0-6-ecpm-really-low.394996/#post-2579051
     
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2016
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  2. unity-nikkolai

    unity-nikkolai

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    Could be a result of how you have ads implemented in game. Can you provide store links for your game (both iOS and Android)? We can look into it further from there. Thanks
     
  3. Dragonic89

    Dragonic89

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    Here are the links :

    Android : https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.chaosvision.zero
    iOS : https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/zer0.io/id1079687871?ls=1&mt=8

    The ad functionnality is really easy to see and use, it's the button at the bottom-right "cancel your last move" ! This will lead the user to an intermediary screen where he can choose to see an ad (and can choose if he want it with or without sounds).

    About the game itself, it's just a little and addictive puzzle-game like 2048 where you need to merge tiles. Your objective is to create the tile n°0 ! Because the time is important for the challenge, some people tend to click too fast. That's why the "cancel last move" functionnality can be useful here and is used !

    Thank you for your time !
     
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2016
  4. unity-nikkolai

    unity-nikkolai

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    It looks like you have about 1K downloads through Google Play. Are you using Analytics in your game? I'm wondering what you ARPDAU is. How many ads do you typically show per user per day?

    Unity Ads has a limit of 25 ads per user per day. Keep in mind that ads will tend to become less effective the more you show them, and as a result will also tend to drive down your eCPM. Which is why I ask about ARPDAU. If you have an ARPDAU of $0.05 or greater, you're actually in good shape.

    We don't yet provide the ability to track ARPDAU through the Unity Ads dashboard, but it is on the short term roadmap.
     
  5. Dragonic89

    Dragonic89

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    Yes, I use Unity Analytics in my game ! Through the admin panel I can see that the value ARPDAU is at 0 from the beginning !




    About the limit, here is a screenshot for an event when a user has succesfully viewed an ad for the reward (for the last month) :



    So about 20~30 unique users for 40~80 ads per day, which is a normal ratio for my game currently !

    I already read about the 25 ads per user per day (before the implementation and the release of the game), and I know that the quality of an ad which is viewed to many times by the same user decrease (and it's not a problem here for the current context : ~2.5 ads per unique user per day) ! But there is a difference between a small revenue from that and 0$.

    Here is the data for active users if this can help :



    Really I don't know what can be wrong ! The implementation of UnityAds in my game is really basic/normal. And it can't be better for the gameplay of this game !
     
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2016
  6. unity-nikkolai

    unity-nikkolai

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    The reason Unity Analytics is showing an ARPDAU of $0 is because statistics for ads isn't being imported into Unity Analytics, at least not yet. This is on the roadmap, and part of the Unity Ads ARPDAU feature I mentioned earlier.

    If you generate reports through Unity Ads for your game, and split by day, you should be able to manually enter the earnings values into Unity Analytics for each day that yields revenue. In cases where there is a lot of revenue, I'd recommend just entering in the monthly value for ARPU and then getting the average daily value to calculate ARPDAU.
     
  7. Dragonic89

    Dragonic89

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    Well, this isn't difficult for this part ! Like I said in the first post, the total revenue is currently 3.02$ from 1.50$ and 1.52$ on two particular days. 1.50$ for DE on 03/03/16 (start/view : 2/2), 1.52$ for GB on 10/03/16 (start/view : 3/3) !

    This kind of datas isn't really helpful !
     
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  8. mpinol

    mpinol

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    Hey @Dragonic89,

    I apologize for any confusion! Currently the ARPDAU on the Analytics Dashboard will only show Verified IAP transactions. We do not currently display any information related to Ads but it is something we are working on! Are there any particular features for displaying Ads revenue information in the Analytics Dashboard that you would like to see?

    Also, it is not possible to manually enter or upload data into the Analytics Dashboard but if this is a feature you would like to see can you please show your support and add/vote for it here, https://feedback.unity3d.com/forums...f8=✓&status=0&category=analytics&view=hottest
     
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  9. Dragonic89

    Dragonic89

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    mpinol : for now I'm not really interested to see any kind of UnityAds data in my UnityAnalytic panel ! But this is because I don't have any revenue data, so will not have anything interesting to see >< !

    I'm trying to understand why my game can't generate proper daily revenues with this basic and good implementation with the gameplay ! I need to find a solution because I want to promote my game further, but I can't let it go like this with such a small eCPM ! Is it really difficult to get some data from Applifier about revenue calculation to see what's wrong here ?
     
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2016
  10. unity-nikkolai

    unity-nikkolai

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    Thanks for the correction, @mpinol! Sorry about the confusion, @Dragonic89.

    The quality of impressions may be lower than average due how they're being utilized in game. It appears there is about 10% opt in rate for ads with daily users, meaning that they chose to watch a video to cancel their last move. This is a pretty solid design, but you may be able to improve on it.

    The reason we recommend rewarding users for watching ads is because it promotes user engagement and provides an opportunity to capture interest in the ad. There is a 97% completion rate on ads in your game, which is great! This means the opportunity to capture interest is there, but if you aren't limiting how often they can use the reward system, you may be losing player engagement as the novelty wears off the more ads are shown.

    One recommendation I would make is to provide a cooldown timer or an interval counter on the button, or only allow them to use the button once per playthrough. You can also use IAP with in-game currency as a way of offering undos. They could then purchase undos with in-game currency, or watch an ad to undo. If a user never purchases any in-game currency, you could increase how often they see the option to view an ad for an undo.

    Inspiration for this monetization design comes from Temple Run 2. I'd recommend checking out their latest version for reference, and perhaps consider implementing something similar your game. You can continue to use custom events through Unity Analytics to determine if this improves user engagement.

    They also offer free in-game currency through their store, which I wouldn't recommend though since there is potential to lose a sale if a potential paying customer entered the store and opted to watch an ad for free currency instead.
     
  11. Dragonic89

    Dragonic89

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    There is always some ways to improve this yes ^^ ! In my case, and for my objective, I really think it's perfect for now !

    I already thought about IAP but I don't want to use this in my game ! No-IAP can be a strong argument to have good user feedbacks in the stores ! My objective with this project is to create the opportunity to have a strong and addicting game like 2048. But not for a revenue objective in the end ^^ ! This is only for me, as a opportunity to complete my portfolio ! And for this it's more important for me to have good feedbacks, so a game without any kind of frustration, wich is the primary cause for IAP. And because I spent 200$ in this project, I thought I may try to get some money back with a small and clearly optional rewarded ad in my game ! This is also an opportunity to implement and test UnityAds for future projects ! But the current result is bad !

    I also already thought about using the undo only one time per playthrought. I didn't choose this option because another functionnality in this game (Joker Bomb) is already limited. And there is no reason with my current gameplay to limit this undo functionality ! If because of this some players saw 4 or 5 ads per day I can't think this is not normal ! And there must be some users who only choose to see 1 ad per day in my data, but this don't generate revenue either for now !

    And an ingame currency is a no-go for this game ! This is really like 2048 : easy/simple game that you can open at everytime when you have 5 minutes, and new players may even don't need a tutorial ! I don't even need a main menu for this game (and don't want to have one ><) ! This simple gameplay is fixed since the beginning, and I really don't wan't to make it more complex !

    But really I can't think that the gameplay/design and ad access are the problem here ! A little puzzle-game like 2048 where users can undo their last move after seing an ad ! And we saw that, on average for players that used this functionnality, thew saw 2.5 ads per day (so maybe some with 4~5 ads per days, and some with only 1 per day). This seems really normal for this kind of puzzle-game, and clearly not too much per user per day ! So if there is no error in the revenue calculation this is almost impossible to create the right scenario to make 6~10$ eCPM (it's not from me, it's from past staff posts for eCPM estimation on UnityAds for a basic implementation) . It's almost luck at this point !
     
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2016
  12. unity-nikkolai

    unity-nikkolai

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    After speaking with @mpinol more about this, another design point came up. You can optimize your use of ads further by identifying how far into gameplay users tend to stop playing. Using custom events and funnels with Unity Analytics can help you identify this through progression.

    You could then tune your game to smooth out the progression curve, and then only offer the undo button after a certain threshold where most users appear to be falling off. This does a few things for you:
    1. Improves overall gameplay by eliminating any unseen vertical walls in the difficulty curve.
    2. Limits the number of ads shown and possibly improves the user experience as a result.
    3. Maintains quality by limiting ads shown to the higher value campaigns in the lineup.
    This has the potential to improve the user experience, but will most certainly improve eCPM values. The goal is to be as efficient as possible when showing ads. By limiting the number of ads shown, and placing them in areas of your game where they can be most effective will help accomplish this.
     
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  13. Dragonic89

    Dragonic89

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    Je vais le refaire en français car il est tard chez moi et parce que j'ai l'impression qu'on tourne en rond sur ce qui n'est pas le sujet donc ça commencer à m’agacer un poil !

    Je ne veux pas changer mon design ><, et je ne pige carrément pas pourquoi l'implémentation actuelle serait mauvaise au point de générer si peu de revenus ! 2.5 pubs par jour en moyenne pour chaque utilisateur unique qui utilise la fonctionnalité ça me semble plus que correct, et très loin d'être excessif ! Du coup je vois pas pourquoi je devrai changer mon design de façon à montrer encore moins de pubs, quitte en plus à complexifier inutilement mon jeu ! Puis bon, en imaginant que j'arrive à limiter à 1 pub par utilisateur par jour (ce que je trouve un peu con du coup, sans compter la frustration que ça va apporter au joueur), on va me faire avaler que ça expliquera la différence entre 0.6$ et 6$ eCPM >< ?! J'utilise en plus que des pubs type rewarded pour être sûr d'augmenter mes chances de gains par rapport à des vidéos skippables.

    J'ai plutôt l'impression que pour l'instant on tente de me trouver des suppositions hypothétiques au résultat actuel en se basant sur le fait que le design n'est pas bon parce qu'il n'y a pas de vraies info sur lesquelles s'appuyer. Cela ne me dis donc pas du tout pourquoi toutes ces vidéos débutées/complétées ne produisent strictement rien, basé sur des faits de calculs.

    Heureusement que je ne suis pas dans un objectif de gain avec ce projet >< ! Mais j'aurai aimé pouvoir gardé une bonne expérience comme référence pour l'implémentation de futurs projets ! Pour l'instant c'est très négatif donc !
     
  14. unity-nikkolai

    unity-nikkolai

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    I completely understand your frustration, and apologise for it. These suggestions are only meant to help with your situation. I have contacted our EMEA AdOps team to see if anyone there can help further. I think your game is promising, and I'd like to see it succeed with Unity Ads. Someone should contact you in the next day or two.

    Feel free to ping me directly if you have any further questions.
     
  15. Dragonic89

    Dragonic89

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    No need to apologize, it's my fault on this last post ! It's not early here in France and I have a lot of work currently ^^ !
    You only try to help me to improve my game, I'm really thankful for that !

    It's just that I don't want to try something else in my game for now ! The current design/gameplay is already a result of many updates and improvements. I don't want to break this current design only to try to have more revenues from ads (user experience and good feedbacks come first for my project). I'm only interested in understanding why the current version isn't a good match with UnityAds for now ! As a developer I need this kind of information so I can have a more flexible reflexion about future implementations.
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2016
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  16. mpinol

    mpinol

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    Hey @Dragonic89,

    Please send me a message if you would like some help implementing Analytics into your game. Each event is just one line of code so you should not need to make many changes to your existing project and I am sure we can get a lot more information about how Ads is working with your current game! It might be pretty helpful to understand exactly what is happening.

    We can also use cool things like funnels with your current Ads related Custom Events, http://forum.unity3d.com/threads/funnel-examples.365978/
     
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  17. unity-nikkolai

    unity-nikkolai

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    Thanks for chiming in, @mpinol!

    @Dragonic89, totally understand. I'm looping in our EMEA AdOps team so you can have someone to discuss these issues within your own time zone. We have a good team there. They should be able to help you out.

    I can relate completely on the design front. I have a small, simple game of my own that I haven't quite figured out how to monetize yet. I was thinking something along your lines of design as well: allow the users a way to continue/undo after watching an ad.

    I like the design of your game, and I agree that it's current design is pretty damn perfect. What I meant to suggest with my recommendations was only minor design changes, or balancing tweaks, and to use Analytics to help back up the value of the design changes. I agree with you on not overcomplicating the game with IAP. Please take the suggestion as just an idea. Which I concede doesn't really apply well in this case, but may still be worth keeping in mind as a counterpoint to ad revenue. I do however strongly recommend improving your analytics tracking in order to determine how many ads your users are actually watching, and how far your players are getting in game. Funnels would serve to indicate where you might have abrupt shifts in the difficulty curve, and may give you a better idea of how your user are actually using ads.

    After this discussion, I think I might try these suggestions in my own game. I'm not really using Analytics yet. I'm only tracking DAUs. I think knowing how many ads people are actually watching would be super helpful. Using funnels would be helpful in visualizing the data in a linear format. You could break out users by number of ads watched per session, or per day. My assumption is that a large number of users never watch ads. There may also be a good number of users who watch one or two ads, and then another large group of users who watch as many ads as possible. I imagine there would visually be a big trough in-between those extremes. However, I still need the analytics data to back it up, though.

    I do believe the best way to optimize this scenario would be to provide the offer only after a certain threshold in order to take advantage of the most effective ads, and improve the gameplay experience by only offering them later in game. An alternative to setting threshold based on the average drop range of all players could be to tailor this threshold on a user specific basis by setting the threshold to the average of their high scores. I'd still recommend testing the effectiveness of this design through analytics as well.

    I hope this helps in some way. Perhaps our AdOps team may be able to answer your question further.
     
  18. Dragonic89

    Dragonic89

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    Thank you @mpinol, I will send you a pm about UnityAnalytics !
    I use it in my game for 24 custom events : use of Joker Bombs, click on the "undo" button, click on facebook/twitter button, finish normal mode, hardcore mode, ....
    I don't know how to use the funnel functionality. Currently I only use UnityAnalytics to show those custom events on the "Data explorer" panel. If you think that something can be done here to track better how ads are used I'm interested ^^ !

    @Unity-nikolai : yes if I can track and identify groups of users who watch as many ads as possible this is a good opportunity. With the datas I posted here about the custom event "ShowAdSuccess" I can only assume that on average I have 2 ads viewed per unique user for thoses who use the functionality. And because I don't have so many user yet (DAU at 186 currently) I assume that yes there is a large number of users who never watch ads and there must be a good number of users who watch one or two ads. The group of users who watch "as many ads as possible" it's really the extreme part, and I don't think it's large. But that's why if I can identify those groups throught analytics I'm interested !

    And yes I hope I will have further informations about the current implementation with the AdOps team, because I don't want to stay stuck with such small and rare revenues from UnityAds ^^ !
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2016
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  19. marc_bearman

    marc_bearman

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    Hi @Dragonic89. Nice to meet you!

    I am based in London and look after our European developers for the Ads division and will definitely be able to help you by looking at the data and explaining what we see with hopes of mutually working to improve.

    I agree that the game is very polished, and as one of the few people that still plays 2048 and have done since the desktop version by Gabriele Cirulli, I am definitely a sucker for this type of game.

    In our system I could find any game under the name Zer0.io and no developer account under your name. Are you able to email me with the details of your account so that I can dig into the data and we can also connect on Skype to talk about optimisations.

    Speak shortly and I look forward to working closely with you.

    Thanks,
    Marc Bearman
    Email: marc@unity3d.com
    Skype: marc.bearman
     
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  20. Dragonic89

    Dragonic89

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    Hello @marc_bearman. Nice to meet you too !

    I just sent you a mail with details on my account. I will have some time next week with Skype if you want to speak about optimisations !

    Thank you for your time !
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2016
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  21. Dragonic89

    Dragonic89

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    As a conclusion after the discussion with @marc_bearman, I need first to recreate a project in the UnityAds panel, without the COPPA target. It's active in my case for now, and this is not a good context for my game.

    Also 5000 is still too few it seems. I was told that "50,000 will start to be indicative.". So I will start to market et promote my games after the next update (some small changes and the new project IDs) in order to reach this new objective if I can do it ! Promote a game for a small indie developer like me isn't really easy ^^, I hope I can achieve the objective !

    Thank you everyone for your help. I hope this new step will lead to some good news this time ^^ !
     
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  22. pKallv

    pKallv

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    Great Unity commitment in this conversation :)
     
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  23. dualcarbon

    dualcarbon

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    CPM is very low at the moment, around $1.60 average. our game is getting around 45-50k completed views daily with earnings at $70-80.
     
  24. Dragonic89

    Dragonic89

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    It's really low yes ! Can we have some details about your game and UnityAds implementation (rewarded, skippable, ..., and maybe country tiers for your users) ? Do you know if there is something that will lower revenues in your case ?
    If a game with an average use of UnityAds and with 45k completed views daily is only getting 70$, it's a problem !
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2016
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  25. dualcarbon

    dualcarbon

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    We have implemented Rewarded video ads in the form of "watch ad and unlock level". The user can watch an ad and unlock the level free, the average time it takes to complete a level is 15mins and only then the user can watch another ad to unlock the next level. So, there is a interval between each ad and the player isnt watching ads one after the another.

    1.jpg
    2.jpg

    screenshots of the stats:
     
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  26. Dragonic89

    Dragonic89

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    Thank you for the data ! It seems to be a good example of a project with a low eCPM with no easy reason at first sight.

    For the data about "Top 10 Countries by Revenue" this is also weird I think ! We can see UK in Tiers 2 (4$ eCPM isn't really high), but no Tiers 1 US, and 8$ eCPM for KR Tiers 3 (I don't know the country tier for Taiwan with 7.5$ eCPM, or Turkey for explaining this low 1$ eCPM for this country). This top 10 this is ~144K videos (so ~44% of all videos for this week), and there is only Korea and Taiwan within the average 6~12$ eCPM for 5K videos total (~2% of all videos for this week).

    I was told to wait 50.000 impressions to see a stable eCPM, but I don't want to be in your case. 1.2M Ad starts and only 1.6$ eCPM this is really low, and moreover you have only rewarded videos like me !

    I think that you need to ask Unity about details for this case if you d'ont have any idea about the current context ! (do it in this topic)

    I think I will merge in a new post data from others developers about revenues, because there is definitely a problem with the "average 6~12$ eCPM" and the "5000 impressions for user quality" from the FAQ I think (seems purely marketing).
    Also revenues calculation is too unpredictable for us developers. We can't use a service that will generate 12$ eCPM for some developers and only 1.5$ eCPM for some others, with no details on the cause for this difference. We need something that will let us more transparency about the system, or at a minimum an easy and faster way to have more details about a low eCPM for a project like yours with more than 50.000 impressions already completed. We can't just accept a "maybe it's because of this" or "maybe you could do that", we need facts and real data !

    Too bad all those ad services are so opaque about this :( ! (not only UnityAds)
     
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2016
  27. Brutusomega

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    dualcarbon, is your game on ios or Android, or both?
     
  28. Dragonic89

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    I think it's Drive Simulator 2016 and maybe Parking Challenge 3D!
    Both on Android and iOS :
    https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.dualcarbon.drivesimulator2016
    https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/drive-simulator-2016/id1081106301?ls=1&mt=8

    https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.parkingchallenge.dualcarbon
    https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/parking-challenge-3d-lite/id562723409?mt=8

    http://www.dualcarbon.com/

    But yes this could be interesting to have more details about ads started between Android/iOS.
     
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2016
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  29. dualcarbon

    dualcarbon

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    The ads have been implemented in Drive Simulator 2016 Lite only not Parking Challenge 3D and the game is available on both Google and IOS platforms, majority of the ads are viewed on Android, in fact 90% of ads run on Android devices and approximately 2000 ads views on IOS daily (can post screenshots if interested). CPM on IOS is slightly better than Android.

    Its really confusing to not know exactly what the reason is for such low CPM. I have been discussing with Unity team via direct email correspondence. They have stated that it could be to do with Ad interaction, and suggested to implement the ads within the levels to increase user interaction with the ads. e.g. An ad at the end screen to double coins by watching a video (we don't have any monetary system in our game yet).

    So my question is, isn't implementing ads in mid-game, beginning/end or anywhere in the game the same? as long as the user watches the ad and completes it is what counts (this is what i assume). When the video plays its concluded with a still image and user can close or click on it. There is only one way a user can interact is by clicking when ad completes. So does it really matter where and when ads are played?

    Any info or advice on this would be much appreciated. I'm glad this thread had been opened and maybe someone can input their experience with Unity Ads.
     
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  30. marc_bearman

    marc_bearman

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    Hi @dualcarbon.

    Thanks for bringing the issue to the forum and to our attention.

    I'll cover of a couple of the comments from @Dragonic89 on this thread firstly as I like to be as transparent as possible:

    "I think I will merge in a new post data from others developers about revenues, because there is definitely a problem with the "average 6~12$ eCPM" and the "5000 impressions for user quality" from the FAQ I think (seems purely marketing)". - Nope, this figure is pretty accurate for what we see as a network, we service over 220 countries but naturally this figure is brought up by the vast amount of impressions generated by the US and CN. If only all of our developer that earn more than the average would comment on this thread :)

    Also revenues calculation is too unpredictable for us developers. We can't use a service that will generate 12$ eCPM for some developers and only 1.5$ eCPM for some others, with no details on the cause for this difference. We need something that will let us more transparency about the system, or at a minimum an easy and faster way to have more details about a low eCPM for a project like yours with more than 50.000 impressions already completed. We can't just accept a "maybe it's because of this" or "maybe you could do that", we need facts and real data. - I agree that having unpredictable revenue is not ideal, and we are sympathetic to this. Regardless of whether advertisers are buying for views or clicks the reality is that all of them are looking for installs for their games. If they see a low amount of installs against a certain traffic source they will either pay a lower CPM or stop buying at all. It is impossible for us to know all of the reasons why any given user base is interested on uninterested in a particular game we advertise. What we can do it give you examples of integrations that have performed well for other games and see if you can emulate them.

    Too bad all those ad services are so opaque about this :( ! (not only UnityAds) - Please feel free to ask me any questions you feel have no clear answer, I will be as transparent as I possibly can.

    Nice to meet you @dualcarbon. Moving on to a couple of your questions:

    Its really confusing to not know exactly what the reason is for such low CPM. I have been discussing with Unity team via direct email correspondence. They have stated that it could be to do with Ad interaction, and suggested to implement the ads within the levels to increase user interaction with the ads. e.g. An ad at the end screen to double coins by watching a video (we don't have any monetary system in our game yet). - I understand the confusion, my answer above covers this topic slightly. I've played your game for 30mins and there aren't that many natural places to put advertising, actually I didn't even get an opportunity to watch an ad, when I completed the first level with unloading the forklift the next on automatically unlocked. I think some of your eCPM concerns are a case of perspective, Turkey and Brazil do bring the average CPM down but then again these are markets where the CPM will be a lot lower as players to make IAP purchases as often or for as much, but there are some promising market in the mix, such as GB, KR, TW and to a lesser extent DE. Also one of the things that stands out is that we show game ads and simulations typically attract a very different audience base that aren't necessarily people that like casual games, and are most like people that are into driving, this will obviously effect their level of interest. Glad to hear the word "yet" when you talked about currency as this could be an option. As you have the paid versions for £1.49 why don't you test non-rewarded video interstitials? From the revenue perspective it will definitely drive upwards, and you could have the option to "remove ads" which would point the user to the paid version.

    So my question is, isn't implementing ads in mid-game, beginning/end or anywhere in the game the same? as long as the user watches the ad and completes it is what counts (this is what i assume). When the video plays its concluded with a still image and user can close or click on it. There is only one way a user can interact is by clicking when ad completes. So does it really matter where and when ads are played? - Theoretically yes all ads should be equal but the reality is there are great differences between them e.g. at the beginning they may have more interest, in the middle they may get frustrated or at the end they just close the game, all of these things effect how the user decides to engage. If presented to the user as an opt in and in a way that helps them progress the performance will be good.

    As a separate suggestion you could look to have levels that need to be completed in a certain amount of time, say 15 mins as you previously mentioned and if you fail to do it in that time you could get an extra X mins for watching an ad.

    I hope some of this was useful, if you want any advice or have further questions please feel free to message on this thread or follow up with me on the contact details below.

    Kind Regards,
    Marc Bearman
    Email: marc@unity3d.com
    Skype: marc.bearman
     
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  31. Dragonic89

    Dragonic89

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    Thank you very much marc_bearman ! This will help to understand a little more how the system work, even if it seems that the only solution for this unpredictable eCPM is to mimic some successful apps for now !

    Yes I have some questions, I would like to dig more on how the system work in order to have all the keys to generate a good implementation of UnityAds.

    Globally I would like to understand how an advertiser campaign, budget and bid are more or less linked to the revenue calculation for an impression/install.

    First I'm trying to understand how the bid have an influence on impressions for an advertiser. For example if as an advertiser I have the lowest bid on a CPCV campaign, does this mean that it will just take more time to be chosen by the service when a user want to see an ad ?

    For a CPI campaign if a user in my app click and install an app after the ad, this will charge the advertiser with the bid per install amount. Is it safe to affirm that a part of this bid will become a revenue everytime ? If "yes" is this ratio almost stable or could it change drastically ? And if "no" what are the possible reasons for a reject of the share of the bid ?

    For a CPCV campaign I think the calcul could be complex, so I will just ask if you have more details on the share of the budget at the end of the campaign.

    Do you have some details on the average ratio between CPI and CPCV campaigns running by advertisers compared to the total budget for these two types ? (for example for a total budget from advertisers last month, maybe 90% of the budget are ont CPI campaigns, and only 10% are on CPCV campaigns).

    Because rewarded videos will result most of the time on completed videos, it's also more likely that the user will install the app for a rewarded video rather than a skippable video. Because of that, does UnityAds prioritizes an impression from a CPCV campaign for a skippable video and an impression from a CPI campaign for a rewarded video ?

    For a CPCV campaign, advertiser is charged on completed impression, so if a user skip a video this will not charge the advertiser from the bid ?

    About the last question I would like to validate and maybe have more details on the part about completion of a video in this post :
    source : http://forum.unity3d.com/threads/below-average-ecpm-value-why-is-my-ecpm-so-low.344647/#post-2230772

    And maybe just ask if "The ad doesn't have to be completed to generate revenue" this will affect only skippable or also rewarded videos.

    I hope my english isn't too bad with all those questions ^^' !
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2016
  32. marc_bearman

    marc_bearman

    Unity Technologies

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    Thanks @Dragonic89 for the very detailed questions. I've done my best to answer them below :) Should you want to talk into these in more detail I'd suggest calling me on Skype whenever suits you, more to save my fingers from typing any longer :D


    1. First I'm trying to understand how the bid have an influence on impressions for an advertiser. For example if as an advertiser I have the lowest bid on a CPCV campaign, does this mean that it will just take more time to be chosen by the service when a user want to see an ad? Simply put yes, the lowest priced campaign will be shown last. It doesn’t just have to be CPCV price but also the complete %.

    2. For a CPI campaign if a user in my app click and install an app after the ad, this will charge the advertiser with the bid per install amount. Is it safe to affirm that a part of this bid will become a revenue every time? If "yes" is this ratio almost stable or could it change drastically? And if "no" what are the possible reasons for a reject of the share of the bid? I am not sure I fully understand the question, but in the case of a CPI campaign you get paid for the install, they don’t have to complete this from the end card, so there won’t always be a click.

    3. For a CPCV campaign I think the calculation could be complex, so I will just ask if you have more details on the share of the budget at the end of the campaign.
    Do you have some details on the average ratio between CPI and CPCV campaigns running by advertisers compared to the total budget for these two types ? (for example for a total budget from advertisers last month, maybe 90% of the budget are on CPI campaigns, and only 10% are on CPCV campaigns). – Just to clarify campaigns run on CPV/CPM also, so there are a mix of metrics that go in. Unfortunately, I can’t share exact breakdowns of campaigns by payment metrics.

    4. Because rewarded videos will result most of the time on completed videos, it's also more likely that the user will install the app for a rewarded video rather than a skippable video. Because of that, does UnityAds prioritizes an impression from a CPCV campaign for a skippable video and an impression from a CPI campaign for a rewarded video? Indeed, we often see engagement rates higher for rewarded video as the user maintains a choice but we don’t restrict running based on expected outcomes, we run based on the performance we see across each game and placement. And like I answered in question one we always serve the campaign we anticipate to reap the highest payout for a given impression based on historical performance and network averages.

    5. For a CPCV campaign, advertiser is charged on completed impression, so if a user skip a video this will not charge the advertiser from the bid? A CPCV would be paid on completion of a view, and yes if the view is not completed the impression would not result in revenue. Rewarded video is always above 90% completion so it isn’t an issue, for non-rewarded that is the trade-off for non-user initiated ad formats.

    6. About the last question I would like to validate and maybe have more details on the part about completion of a video in this post:

    If an ad campaign is run using CPCV, revenue can appear at anytime during a seven day attribution window after the ad is shown. The ad doesn't have to be completed to generate revenue, but completion rates have a tendency to correlate with the eCPM value, or the effectiveness of each ad impression.
    We do take some time to attribute all activity back to a specific game, so there can be delays in revenue displaying, but as a rule of thumb 7 days is more linked with installs which act as a measurement of cost effectiveness for the CPCV price.

    Thanks,
    Marc Bearman
     
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  33. Dragonic89

    Dragonic89

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    Thank you @marc_bearman, and sorry for the late response ^^ !

    I didn't made any change in my game since the beginning of this topic. I will share the current state of my UnityAds account since the launch of my app :



    So almost the same state than in the first post : ~1$ eCPM with very few revenues over time. DAU is also the same (~250).

    Sadly I don't have so much free time for now to test some new configurations in order to find the right solution to increase revenues. If the DAU is the problem, then this is the visibility of my app that I need to increase ^^ ! Other than that, I can only think on restrict how often a user can view an ad in my app, but that will break a little the attractive gameplay of the game. Or maybe it's just the common player of my game who isn't the kind to install after an ad, and if this is the primary problem then I can't do anything about that ^^' !

    All those answers helped me a lot to understand how this system works, I'm very grateful for that. But I don't know if I will use UnityAds the next time because it's too unpredictable for me who like precise data, and even with all those anwsers I still have no idea how to create a project with UnityAds that will always reach the average eCPM. Without this minimum insurance on revenues (which can fluctuate here from 0.5 $eCPM to >12$eCPM without any simple reason, this is a huge "unpredictable" difference), I can't possibly think on using only this system if I want to become a full-time mobile indie dev in the near future ^^' !

    But I hope that I will change my mind sooner or later if I can find and understand how to create a game that will use the service at its fullest.
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2016
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  34. WikiMalik

    WikiMalik

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    @Dragonic89 Thanks for the detailed insight on UnityAds and sharing all that data.

    But I don't know if I will use UnityAds the next time because it's too unpredictable for me who like precise data.
    You have made a wise choice!

    This conversation helped a lot learn about how unpredictable UnityAds are.. and unpredictable is really just another word for unreliable. On a different a forum I learned that Unity pays $6-$12/1000 impressions and Ironically I thought that was too low. But Dragonic's data really cleared it off.

    Unity says right on its dashboard. $6-$12 /5000 impressions. That's a hell lot of videos to show for that amount especially if it's more $6 than $12. I know Admob and Facebook ads aren't far too much accomplished, but they are not asking users to watch not-so-data-cheap video ads. @dualcarbon. 's numbers (70$/45k impressions) remind us that we, as developers, are being rushed with new offers that really just repeat the old story.

    Thanks for developers comments too. I need to plan another strategy, and start looking at other options.
     
  35. _MGB_

    _MGB_

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    We're coming to the same conclusion too; this system is just too opaque to put our trust in.
     
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  36. Dragonic89

    Dragonic89

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    After almost a year, without any change, the app get now ~100 ads per week, and here is a screenshot of my report for top tiers :



    0.69$ eCPM for the tier 1 US !
    Only one revenue for a tier 2, and nothing at all for 4961 completed for tier 2 NZ, or 3031 completed for tier 3 FR, ... ! -_-

    I'm sorry but I can only say after this that UnityAds is not reliable at all !
    I would love to have a positive review for this service because Unity is a wonderful tool, but for UnityAds I just can't !

    Revenues must be 99.9% based on app installs after the ads, but we don't even have this kind of info on the report, and I can't predict that players will click to install after the ads !

    If you want some stable revenues based on view / completed views, you have to find another service for your app !

    Anyway, thank you everyone for your help on this topic, and I hope you will find the secret formula to use UnityAds at his best for your project if you want to use it !
     
    Last edited: Dec 3, 2016
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  37. tessellation

    tessellation

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    Maybe your game is so addictive that players don't want to bother to click on the ads and install another app because that would take them away from your app.
     
  38. Lucates

    Lucates

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    When i m reading this how low you paying and how expensive u selling advertising got no point to advertise by your company. Re manage this or go down some day.
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2017
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  39. Antony-Blackett

    Antony-Blackett

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    I would suggest implementing some ad mediation. User a system like Fyber or Iron Source and you'll get a good idea about which networks are performing well and which aren't. If all networks aren't performing then you know there's a design issue in your game.
     
  40. mrcggl

    mrcggl

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    @Dragonic89 thanks for all the details and the last update. as indi dev i now have the same problems with the revenue like you. do you have found a better payed solution or service?
     
  41. nmndwivedi

    nmndwivedi

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    Wow, this is so sad. Hard working indie devs not getting paid for doing the job :( I think I will go for an ad mediation platform, I spoke to a Tapdaq representative and the service seems quite promising with all its features...you can manually set eCPM floors and the algorithm chooses the best deal for you by mixing up platforms, apparently it increases revenues by upto 50% over traditional ad networks. Anyone else got any experience with mediation networks?
     
  42. Antony-Blackett

    Antony-Blackett

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    Fyber and Iron Source are both robust and decent form my experience.
     
  43. Vishwa001

    Vishwa001

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    I don't think unity ads is good for not very popular or low audience game. It is very good for High Audience game. Conclusion is that its not for Indie Developer.
     
  44. pKallv

    pKallv

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    So what is a good ads platform for indie developers?
     
  45. Antony-Blackett

    Antony-Blackett

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    Super Sonic, use mediation then you can implement a bunch very easily and find out what fits your app best. not all games will perform as well as each other with the same network as they serve different ads. The same is true for the same app over time as advertisers change and may match or not match your audience better or worse over time.
     
  46. Leonid

    Leonid

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  47. Bushido_Interactive

    Bushido_Interactive

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    Admob and Facebook Audiance Network is most effective in compare in unity ads
     
  48. Fikani4Games

    Fikani4Games

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    Dragonic89 i dont want to say you are completely right, but really you clarify a lot in this conversation, I suggest that Unity Ads team, just make something like minimum ECPM = 6$ and maximum ECPM = 10$ , if this is true that the average is between 6 and 12, so we will all work on something real.
     
  49. Guillaumzed

    Guillaumzed

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    This is my results for the last month for Admob and Unity Ads.

    The ad, in both cases, is a rewarded video launched at the same spot in the game : just before a level is launched. Each level last approximately 5 minutes. The game is available in approx. 30 countries : english, french and spanish speaking countries + Germany and Italy.
    It serves the ad which is loaded first, with Admob priorized if they are both available at the same time (I don't know if it's a good practice to do that, but this way, my players doesn't wait too much when ads are loading). At first I did the contrary (Unity Ads priorized over Admob) but I reversed it because of slightly better revenue results with admob.
    If money was not a problem, I would reverse it again to priorize Unity Ads instead because I prefere them (They are shorter).

    UNITY ADS (last 30 days)
    Ecpm: 3,58$
    Impressions : 7.565
    Revenue : 27$

    ADMOB (last 28 days)
    Ecpm : 7,3$
    Impressions : 16.600
    Revenue : 121$

    In both cases (Unity Ads and Admob), I have some days with only 0.01$ revenues, and suddenly on day in the week, 14$. It looks completely unpredictable. But it's running since 2 months now an these Ecpm seem consistant if I compare the 2 months results.
     
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2017
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  50. ardimh7

    ardimh7

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    can you give more detailed data, maybe some screenshots of day-to-day impressions, how many ad started and finished, and the country tiers? thank you very much
     
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