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Oculus - Quest vs Rift S

Discussion in 'AR/VR (XR) Discussion' started by neginfinity, Jul 30, 2020.

  1. neginfinity

    neginfinity

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    I didn't notice that it uses USB C, and I don't have a single cord or adapter for that in my apartment. I'll go shopping when stores finally open.

    ---

    By the way, does anyone experience change in perception of object size while in the helmet? It feels like many objects are perceived smaller than they should be even at maximum IPD, but when, say a conrtol panel jumps in front of them, my brain adjusts and starts seeing them as huge.

    Also I'm feeling a bit of disorientation after viewing stuff while sitting - when I take off the helmet. Mostly things are much crisper in reality, like I'm wearing glasses again, and perception of sizes seems to be a bit screwed up for a while. (I swear I'm not kidding) Did anyone experience something like that?

    This seems a bit similar:
    https://forums.oculusvr.com/communi...eird-things-during-and-after-vr-is-it-just-me
     
  2. MDADigital

    MDADigital

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    Scale in VR is super important. Your brain knows right away when an object is at the wrong size. We have spent alot of time making sure each object has the correct real life size, most VR devs dont :D
     
  3. Martin_H

    Martin_H

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    Unless all parameters are *perfect*, everything looks wrong. It's a major downside of VR. The IPD of the displays alone can't fix this, you also need to be able to adjust the IPD of the virtual camera in the game. Not every game offers such a slider I think and I don't think it's implemented on driver-level (not sure though). With filmed VR content you can't adjust it at all, so if things look off-scale, you're stuck with it. Adjusting display IPD mostly just changes how much cross-eyed you need to go at the same virtual object distance, which does a tiny bit to adjust your impression of scale, but is a limited effect and also can be very uncomfortable. When panels jump in front of movie content in most players, it switches the background to Monoscopic, so the depth information is lost and everything seems too big. Close one eye and alternate through which eye you're looking. If you see the exact same image with both, you're seeing monoscopic content.


    I felt weird for about a week or so after getting my Oculus Go, even when not wearing it. It didn't last long though and doesn't happen anymore.




    P.S.: What do y'all think is a more sensible investment, a VR Headset, a big 4k TV, or a PS5? Just curious.
     
  4. MDADigital

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    On SteamVR with a headset that reports IPD (HTC Vive, Valve Index among others) the driver will correct for you. With correct IPD and correct scales in game objects will appear correct size.
     
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  5. neginfinity

    neginfinity

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    Actually, headset. In my case.

    PS5 isn't out yet (no price announcement), and I won't benefit from 4k resolution. Headset is arguably usable as a development tool. Plus it is the cheapest from the 3.

    Unless you're aiming to buy Index, or something...

    Basically, you have two purely entertainment devices, and one with some development utility. So the one with development utility is arguably more valuable.

    Unless it was your dream to buy a 4k TV, and buying owning this TV will provide massive positive mood boost.
     
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  6. Martin_H

    Martin_H

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    @neginfinity: so after a couple of months, what's your verdict on the Quest and VR in general? Are you still using it regularly?

    I got back in touch with someone I know who has a vive and asked if he's still using it. He said it's too much hassle to set up everything. Hasn't even played HL Alyx. It seems like every last one of the people that I know IRL who have VR headsets, completely stop using them after a while.
     
  7. neginfinity

    neginfinity

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    Hi there.

    I'm using it regularly, but mostly for beat saber. It provides decent workout which I actually need (due to circumstances), so basically I'm using it on every weekday.

    There's no hassle to setup the quest, because you basically put it on and play anywhere, just need to clear a bit of space if you play it standing. You occasioanlly need to redraw the boundary, which is slightly annoying (as it doesn't have "erase" function), but that's the extent of it.

    With VR in general, however, I'm royally bummed out by facebook's attempts to monopolize the tech. Quest 2 is cheaper and has better specs than Quest 1, but requirements for facebook account is a deal breaker for me, so basically my headset in two years will become a brick and I'll need to switch to something else. You also can't buy Quest 1 anymore, even if you get a brand new Quest 1, you won't be able to use it without a facebook account, and facebook bans people at random (then acts smug about it). I heard sony was making some sort of goggles, maybe that will go live by then. Still, I was very upset at their announcement. There were rumors about jailbreak and lawsuit, but there's no jailbreak, and given that facebook can pay five billion dollar fines as if it is nothing, nothing is going to improve.

    Regarding games, basically I clocked quite a lot of time in No Man's Sky in VR mode, built a decent movement tolerance in something like a month. Unless it is windy grassfield, I can use smooth movements, jump off skyscrapers and so on with no nausea for a long periods of time. There were definitely fun experiences in Anyland (it has tiny community, but you need to try it if you have the chance. It is unique), or VR Chat (ever tired to talk to brazilian in Japanese when you only remember 200 words or so? Because you don't know portoguese, and he doesn't know english? Lots of fun), although the social-focused games have a big problem - it is unclear what the hell are you supposed to DO there. And it would be better if the players were working towards some sort of goal together. There are a lot of weirdos too, for example, VRChat has insane amount of people wearing anime girl avatars (I don't get it despite having decent amount of anime), and there's definitely adult entertainment there somewhere in private rooms.

    As far as games go, the top experience is probably no man's sky, with beat saber having maximum utility. Blade and Sorcery was fun too, but it ahs a single dev, so it isn't improving quickly and had AI problems. Alyx was cool, but it is a game you'll probably only play once. Nice story, tiring if you play it standing, but once you've finished it, that's it. Speaking of beat saber, I think developers are not doing a great job maintaining their game, as most work was done by the community, who modded the hell out of the game. Unmodded game is quite barebones.

    Another thing that affects VR experience that due to pandemic and recent bitcoin uptick, I'll be unable to upgrade my hardware for some time. My GPU is barely VR capable, so ideally I'd want a better one. All GPUs are currently overpriced, and things sometimes are so bad that decent GPUs aren't even available. One computer stores in my town, for example, simply does not have any 6GB GPUs in stock. They're all gone. You can't even get 1660. The only available cards right now are GTX 1650, 1050Ti, GT 1030, GT 730, RX 550, an Quadro cards. All overpriced. The only availbale 16 GB is Quadro P5000, which goes for an equivalent of $2000. And that's a huge chain of computer stores that span dozens of cities, and not some small distributor. Other store has some RTX cards available but they have prices doubled or tripled compared to MSRP. It is not worth the money in my opinion.

    Aside from that.... in the future I'd be interested in having a higher resolution headset that is not locked behind some nonsensical account. Mostly to have a virtual WORK environment with desktops. The tech for virtual environments and desktops, however, currently is not that great. Some solutions struggle streaming 3x fullhd monitors into helmet, and a lot of them act as SAAS, trying to lock you behind their own login and monthly fees. Which is suboptimal. Also ideas like streaming video through USB cable by compressing it don't look that smart to me. It has to be a display connector.
    The reason why I'd want to that is because in Quest 1, while you CAN read text on virtual a fullhd monitor it is definitely suboptimal, and you'll need to make the monitor quite big for it to work.

    Another thing that is currently lacking is full body tracking. Solutions exist, but they're a bit non-standard, rely on VIVE lighthouses and cost quite a lot. Hopefully in the future there will be a cheaper option.

    And that's the rough idea of it.

    Feel free to ask additional questions...
     
  8. Martin_H

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    Hi there!
    Thanks a lot for the detailed report. This was very interesting and encouraging to read. Good job sticking with the daily workout! I really need to start doing something as well and I just can't motivate myself to do any of the boring stuff. So I thought if there's a chance that beat saber does help me get in shape too, I guess I have to try it. I just ordered a quest 2 from Amazon France. You can't buy them in Germany yet because of legal issues with their lacking data privacy. I respect and support your no-compromise stance on Facebook! But since I already have a (barely used) facebook account and an Oculus Developer Account, I'll begrudgingly add another FB account to the list if neccessary.

    I guess the main questions that I have left are what do I need to play steam games with it and is there some guide with gotchas to be aware of? Is this the best tool for streaming games?
    https://www.oculus.com/experiences/quest/2017050365004772/

    I only have a gtx 1060, but I hope on reduced quality settings HL Alyx etc. will work. For beatsaber, should I be getting the PC version or native Quest 2 version?
     
  9. MDADigital

    MDADigital

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    Moss, you can't miss out on that gem

    Edit: PC version, quest version looks like a pile of... :)
     
  10. bobisgod234

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    If the PC version runs fine, might as well get the PC version. You can stream it to the Quest via Quest Link.
     
  11. neginfinity

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    You need Virtual Desktop to stream games from PC wirelessly, and you HAVE to buy it from oculus store (and not from steam). Oculus store doesn't do regional discounts, so the price will likely be in dollars. Then you'll need to register as a developer so you can sidelout quest part of that software onto your headset. To sideload stuff you'll need sidequest ( https://sidequestvr.com/), which comes with its own store and free stuff.

    You can also stream things through USB cable via Quest Link, but Quest is very picky when it comes to cable quality, and Quest link is more resource hungry than virtual desktop.

    Speaking of Virtual Desktop, I recommend 5Ghz router (preferably without crowded 5ghz range), then set codeec to H264 and bitrate to 100. This will result in best quality. At lower settings games with a lot of gray (say, SkyrimWR) start losing details.

    Also, with Virtual Desktop you can play wirelessly, so you'll get about 2 hours of fun before the headset needs recharging. Should be a lot of fun in a big room if you got one.

    I have 3 gigabyte GTX 1060, and I completed Alyx with it. You won't be running it on ultra, though. I've finished it through Virtual Desktop. Because if you try playing it via Link, it will stutter often. I think that's because the amount of memory is below minimum reqruiements for Quest Link listed on site, so it hits the swap or does something similar. The minimum is 6gb.

    Buying 3gb version of 1060 was my blunder, but to be honest I've bought it long time ago preparing for VR, and its price was 1/4 of what it is now. I'm not sure how this card would perform at Quest 2, because Queest 2 has higher resolution.

    PC version supports mod and 3rd party songs through ModAssistant and beatlist. I'm not sure if quest version is moddable. I think it is, but I'm not certain. I play on PC.

    For example, this is modded game:
    This is a side screenshot of me playing with this mod
    upload_2021-2-5_4-14-52.png

    The song is third party, avatar support is 3rd party mod. Also this girl has full body support which the quest doesn't have out of the box and which I don't have. (Full body tracking would require vive lighthouses and body trackers. It'll be something like $600).

    Wireless streaming adds some extra latency, but for vast majority of games it is not noticeable. I do think that I'm starting to see its effects on expert songs, but I'm not sure yet. If you haven't played beatsaber before, it'll probably take you something in ballpark of 40 hours to get to expert level.

    Beware of muscle pain, by the way.

    I use virtual desktop. It is less resource hungry than Quest Link. Also, link is picky towards cables.
     
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  12. MDADigital

    MDADigital

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    The 1060 wasn't even a good card for VR when it was new. I wouldnt recommend anyone using it for VR.
     
  13. neginfinity

    neginfinity

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    I'll make sure to use 48 computer CPU/96 RTX 3090 cluster the next time. I mean it would be perfect with my liquid nitrogen cooling sytem, nuclear powered 50 megawatt psu, and Pimax 32k along with custom made lawnmoverman machine and 64 point fullbody tracking suit. I mean, it had to be the perfect setup to use in the zeppelin *nods sagely*. Although, boy does that that protective fighter wing and the aircraft carrier group get annoying sometimes. But even getting that nuclear sub was totally justified to keep visitors away! So there will be no interruptions in the middle of pacific! Even diverting the ISS was truly worth it so it. I mean It shone in my eye once during the night!

    You have to try this config out to understand. Any other setup is inferior.

    The one. Truly. PREMIUM. Experience playing. BeatSaber.

    It is worth it.

    .
    .
    .
    .
    .
    .
    .

    Not. Helpful.

    As I said, hardware's is simply not available, and shortages likely will last throughout the year. Stuff like beatsaber can run on a toaster, and majority of titles do not have trouble running. There also isn't anything that would justify buying expensive VR GPU at current inflated prices. As quite a lot of titles strive to be Quest compatible.
     
  14. MDADigital

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    Most of those titles are better played on PC versions anyway, because they look like crap. Beat saber is not the best example, its not really a game in the sense even.

    Those guys can really laugh all the way to the bank. 5 minutes to develop and a 30 USD price tag.
     
  15. Antypodish

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    And? Lokks like they nailed it. You bought it, they sold it, they win.

    Even minecraft is not a game in a sense. It is just a sandbox. Oh common... o_O
     
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  16. Ryiah

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    Meanwhile a certain realistic military simulation is taking years to develop and has barely made money. :p
     
  17. MDADigital

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    I think you should make the games you like and want to make. If you purely make a game to make money, you will not make any money. I wish I wanted to make a hyper casual music game with one scene and 5 minute development cycle :p

    edit: also the Unity game engine is much better suited for a small scope like that
     
  18. neginfinity

    neginfinity

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    Clear this track and then we can talk about how casual it is:

    Bonus points if you do this on the first try. Good luck.
     
  19. MDADigital

    MDADigital

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    Don't have the game. Casual isn't necessarily not hard its juts a lower bar to get started
     
  20. neginfinity

    neginfinity

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    No, Casual specifically means "easy" and "relaxed" and "doesn't require a lot of skill".

    Then you should buy it and you should play it.

    Those guy nailed it, produced an arcade gameplay hit that has been selling for 2.5 years as hot cakes, and you're trying to demean it without having played it.

    Like I said, clear that track first.
     
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  21. Martin_H

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    I still don't believe you're Anders' colleague and not himself. ^_^


    Thanks a lot! I think I have the 6gb version of the 1060, I bought it originally for rendering bigger scenes in Cycles.
    I just checked and the RTX 3070 seems to be ~900 Euro and the 3090 is over 2000 Euro...yikes. I'm not convinced it's worth that to me.

    I think my router supports 5ghz, but the range is probably rather crowded here. I can get close to the router though, if that helps. I'll see how it goes in a week or so.

    That's awesome! One of the few songs I ever bothered to at least partly learn to play on the guitar. I hope they have Dead Skin Mask too. If that's what I need modding for, PC version it is then.
     
  22. Ryiah

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    One of my favorite hardware reviewers has been suggesting people mine cryptocurrency while not actively using their cards to make up for the increased cost of the cards. An RTX 3080, for example, with a power cost of $0.25 per kilowatt currently makes $11/day or a little more than $4,000 per year.

    You won't make a living using the card in this manner but you definitely can subsidize the cost of the hardware.

    https://www.nicehash.com/profitability-calculator/nvidia-rtx-3080
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2021
  23. MDADigital

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    Why should I play a genre that I dont care one bit for? I like immersive VR games, like moss, Alyx, our own game etc.

    Alyx is interesting though, the VR aspect is pretty weak, immersion breaking HUD, pretty low VR interaction level etc. But still it's such an awsome VR experience. The jeff level is pretty much probebly the best experience I had in any game in my 40 years.
     
  24. MDADigital

    MDADigital

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    No casual means the game has a low skill entry level or requirement. It says nothing about skill ceiling
     
  25. Martin_H

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    That would maybe financially make sense, but I can't justify the environmental impact and my room already gets way too hot during summer, so mining cryptocurrency is the last thing I'd want to do during half of the year.
     
  26. Ryiah

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    Make a donation to an environmental charity. Just as an example here is one dollar per tree in South America.

    https://onetreeplanted.org/products/andes?variant=18685803823166

    Check with your power company to see if they can sell you solar power instead of fossil fuel power. My power company sells solar power 50 kilowatts at a time for $4.50 which is $0.09 per kilowatt.

    https://www.mycvec.com/energy-solutions/community-solar

    Just think you could make money and heat your room during winter.
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2021
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  27. MDADigital

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    4k USD spread over a year is not much to care about. More so since you need a computer running for it 24/7. Also having a highend GPU running 24/7 isnt exactly good for the environment
     
  28. Ryiah

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    While I love the conspiracy theory that you're Anders Malmgren, I'm much more inclined to believe people in your area of the world have gotten too used to high numbers to understand that for some people that is a lot of money.

    I'm thinking I might start multiplying everything by a factor of ten when I mention numbers to you.

    One high-end graphics card has very little impact on the environment. It's only once you start dealing with them in bulk that they start being questionable. If you want to lessen the impact to the environment you would have much more success riding a bicycle than turning off your computer.
     
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  29. MDADigital

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    well, you think you are alone in the world mining for bitcoins? offcourse not.. Those will leave footprint, more so in this part of the world were they shutdown nuclear powerplants for less environmental friendly alternativs

    I'm the CTO Anders Malmgren is the CEO. We have very similar ideas though. Birds of a feather stick together.
     
  30. Ryiah

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    Neither are gamers alone in the world and there are at least as many gamers as there are cards mining.

    And an equally bizarre misunderstanding of the value of money in other sections of the world. :p
     
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  31. MDADigital

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    They dotn maximize the GPU 24/7.
     
  32. Martin_H

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    Thanks! I already planted a couple trees with the #teamtrees thing and have a 100% renewable energy sources contract from my power company (it's barely any more expensive, everyone who can should get one). But wasting energy is still wasting energy, even if done in the most eco friendly way possible. I could afford a 2k € card if I really wanted to, but I don't think I could enjoy it at that price, and feeling obligated to run a crypto mining operation just to offset some of the ludicrous cost only further diminishes my enjoyment of such a product.


    I work from home, don't own a car and usually don't do long distance travel. Apart from food and heating, my computer use probably is a fairly big part of my CO2 footprint.


    I refuse to believe that. You two would be more similar to each other than all the identical twins that I know. x]
     
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  33. MDADigital

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    We are brothers actually. Not twins though :D
     
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  34. Ryiah

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    Meanwhile it's the only way I could justify let alone afford the card and I would only run it for the length of time to make up the ludicrous cost. After that I would stop because I don't want to exhaust the card's life on it. That said I'm likely just going to wait out this whole situation and buy it for a somewhat normal price.

    Though I don't expect the cost of graphics cards to truly go back to where they were a few years ago. We're likely always going to have an increased price thanks to current circumstances just like the RTX 30 series MSRP is much higher thanks to the precedent set by the RTX 20 series.
     
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  35. MDADigital

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    The 1080 TI card was a mistake by nvidia. It was a very good value for the money card. The 2 series was insanely priced. The 3 series a little better. But prices like the 1080 TI will probably stay rare.

    Computer hardware is deductable expensive so it's basicly free.
     
  36. Martin_H

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    Ok, then maybe there is a chance you aren't his alt-account x].


    Fair enough! Just be aware that the crypto farming viability can change considerably over time.


    Unless they keep beeing production capped by the raw materials used to make the chips, I think the prices will go down again as crypto currency farming gets less viable. I'm pretty sure Bitcoin is gonna crash again, like it did before (right after I started buying some).
     
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  37. Ryiah

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    Your brother too neglected to realize that not everyone has the same tax laws, and that's making the assumption said taxes will have been sufficient that the return will cover the full cost of the graphics card, and even if it does you still need your budget to cover the period between buying it and receiving the tax refund.
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2021
  38. MDADigital

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    Most western countries have some sort of tax system for this. Granted its extra benefitial for us here in Sweden since the tax is so high.

    I paid 17000 SEK for my 3090 VAT is deductible so left is 13600 if I would take that out in salary i would get 5300 SEK (630 USD). That's an inexpensive 3090 :)

    This is going off topic though. 1060 and more so the 3 gb version is not ideal for VR. The high resulotion eats vram.
     
  39. neginfinity

    neginfinity

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    This track doesn't come with the game and has to be downloaded through beatlist/3rd party sites.

    One thing about mining is that it puts hardware under significant strain.
    Few weeks ago I decided to check how much my configuration can make by mining, started a miner. Then cooler fans spun up aaaaand 10 seconds later my PC shut down. Because PSU died. That was fun.

    On other hand I understand why people look into mining. Currently buying a mining card can be more profitable than say, trying to put money into a bank.
     
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  40. MDADigital

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    Look into seasonic titan PSUs they are awesome
     
  41. Martin_H

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    I got my Oculus Quest 2 this tuesday. Beat Saber is great and my arms hurt like hell from muscle soreness. I think this has a real chance of becoming a regular excercise routine for me. Which is great, because that's the main reason I bought the device.

    Most other things were somewhat disappointing. I had looked at the min specs of the wrong version of Virtual Desktop, so the version that I'd need to stream PC games doesn't run (can't even install it). I requested a refund for the VD version that I bought on the Quest.
    I was too optimistic about the needed physical space for most games too. Beat Saber is the maximum of physical movement that I have the space for in my tiny apartment. So a game like thrill of the fight which needs 2 x 2 meter just isn't possible because there is no 2 x 2 meter area without furniture here, and not enough space to just move it out of the way temporarily.
    "Smooth movement" with the thumbstick makes me feel nauseous (this was expected), but it seems like most games that would interest me don't offer teleport movement or only run on PC. From what I've seen so far, I have a hard time imagining to enjoy this movement scheme for regular shooter gameplay even if it didn't make me sick. Maybe once Doom3Quest gets teleport movement I'll try that.
    The headset itself is less comfortable to wear than the Oculus Go. The face cover material is terrible and gets sweaty even without moving around. After a round of Beat Sabre it's soaking wet. Same goes for the plastic of the controllers, makes my hands sweat just from holding them. The headstrap is worse than that of the Go and it's harder to keep it fixed in the right position to see clearly.
    The display is a bit better than on the Oculus Go, but not by a big enough margin to make me stop using the more comfortable Oculus Go. And it still feels like having a screen strapped to my face instead of really "being there".
    The data privacy issues with facebook devices are straight up dystopian, long term I'd want to have only non-Oculus headsets from a more trustworthy company.
    Before I get to try Half-Life Alyx I might need to buy a new PC first (because I don't want to install win 10 on my current one if it can be avoided, and that's what I'd need for Virtual Desktop), and I'd ideally also need to move to a new place with more space.

    There was one positive surprise though - gravity sketch vr works surprisingly well! I didn't have this on my radar at all, but if the export via their cloud service (which I haven't tried yet) works well, there is a real chance I could use this as part of my 3D toolchain.


    @neginfinity: Any advice on how to git gud at Beat Sabre? I'm having trouble with the blocks where the direction indicators vanish and there's one level with those where I'm not allowed to miss and iirc also have a max number of bad cuts. Everything else so far was pretty easy, but this combination is like a brick wall to me.
     
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  42. MDADigital

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    Good stick movement implemntation has gradual FOV reduction. So you can gradually decrease this as you getting used to the locomotion

    Edit: why not windows 10?
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2021
  43. neginfinity

    neginfinity

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    It is possible to play thrill of the fight in smaller area, although you risk punching out a bookshelf/wall. The minimum area is 1.5x1.5 meter even though the game wants more. You can't play it in a closet or standing completely still in "games without movement" mode, though, because it asks you to spread out arms wide to press buttons.

    Getting used to smooth movement took me either a month or two. Before that point smooth movement would make me sick in under two hours. In the worst cases it was motion sickness and stomach churning nausea in a few minutes. Getting used to smooth movement royally sucks (partly because you keep thinking "you paid how much for the device that makes you want to puke?"), but you sorta need to go through the process once.

    Yup. The account requirements and facebook behavior in general convinced me that Facebook is either a becoming a cyberpunk Corp straight from Shadowrun, or is the closest thing we have to a digital Satan.

    Erm... I forgot about requirements for the streamer and I forgot about you using Windows 7, it looks like the minimum requirements for the streamer is Windows 8. Probably because Microsoft introduced Windows mixed reality around that point and on Windows 7 it didn't exist.

    There's also "Quill". It is really nice, but I'm not sure if it is only available from PC or from Quest too. You should also check out Quill theater while you're at it. And also Oculus TV. There were some movies with depth, like Notre Dame, or big cat rescue footage.

    Looks like you're playing campaign. Basically I'm playing "solo" for exercise purposes and I'm playing modded songs. I could probably record some if you want...

    You get better with practice. It took me roughly 20 hours to be able to beat SOME expert level songs, but that was span over many weeks because sessions were short.
     
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  44. Martin_H

    Martin_H

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    I tried one that does that, but it still makes me feel nauseous instantly. I'm not sure the FOV could be made small enough that it wouldn't make me sick anymore.

    The thought of re-installing windows makes me want to blow my brains out. It would take literal days to re-install the bazillion audio plugins that I have one by one, fiddle with all the copy protection things again, verify that everything works or look for workarounds if it doesn't. I've used this Windows install for about a decade, and I'm not ruling out using it for another decade if I can. If I move to another place I might buy a new gaming PC and use this one as a work PC maybe.


    After having read about the theory that they're running their VR business at a loss, just to gather tons of new data from the devices to train their neural networks on, I'm inclined to think they're going for both - Cyberpunk Corp and digital Satan.


    From what I read it's recommended to stop playing when you feel sick, so that you don't condition yourself to associate VR with feeling sick. But I feel instantly sick when I use smooth movement. I press the stick once and I think "oh god, make it stop". So I'm not sure how any sort of getting used to it is supposed to happen here.


    Thanks for the recommendations. Quill is still PC only, but they have Quill theater for the quest, I'll check it out. I'll give Oculus TV a go too, but the "normal" video content I checked out with the Oculus Go in the past was varying between terrible and meh. A lot of it wasn't even stereoscopic, many had camera movement (which is way worse than stick movement in games), and the image quality was underwhelming. VR tiger/lion sounds interesting though.

    Thanks, but no need to record anything. Beat Saber is one of those games that are fun to play but I find it really boring to watch.

    I thought I'll play through the campain once first to get used to everything and then go for solo play. I've already done a couple songs rated as "hard", but the one I'm stuck at is rated only as normal. I double-checked and it doesn't have a max-bad-cuts limit, but you still can't make infinite ones before you fail. So I either fail from missing blocks or cutting the wrong direction too often and I've already tried more often than I had to for some Dark Souls bosses.

    In solo play, can you freely set the modifiers? That would be a way to practice that song with the vanishing indicators and without the don't miss a note requirement. I have to check that out when I play again.
     
  45. neginfinity

    neginfinity

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    It is VR, it is not exactly "FOV", but "vignettes" - dark borders at the edge of your vision. Games use either vignettes or helmets to reduce nausea. Quest should include that "Tron Discball" game (Echo?) and Rollercoaster. Those use helmets.

    I think I mentioned this before, but in my first ever exposure to VR smooth movement (I think I tried playing compound) I got motion sickness almost instantly.

    Well, I had a good reason to jump from 7 to 10, as in my case Windows 7 no longer worked properly.

    I saw this advice too, but the thing is, you simply won't be able to continue playing for long when you get nausea, because it'll simply become too strong at some point.

    I suppose the process of "getting used to it" would be to start with teleport movement and snap turn.
    Then change snap turn to smooth turn. Then switch to smooth movement.

    Basically I was getting used to it while playing alyx. Alyx is about 15 hours long, I think I switched to smooth turn 5 or 6 horus in, and smooth movement, 8..10 hours in, but I was still getting nauseous in two hours time. Eventually I got used to it. Basically in Alyx you'd end up using movement in short bursts, so I suppose you end up buiding tolerance.

    When you get VR capable PC, try to find "Introduction to Light Fields" and corresponding video version of it.
    https://augmentedperception.github.io/deepviewvideo/
    This thing is amazing, but it is not an industry standard (yet?), so there isn't any content in this format aside from the demo.

    Also, if you want Depth, a good idea would be to stick to 180 videos. Those pretty much always have depth. 360 degrees videos most of the time do not, and even when they do, the effect is weaker.

    Try playing "Breezer" on hard. It is quite interesting the first time you run into it. You should encounter it during campaign mode.

    Yep. You can set "No Fail" and it won't stop the song even if you run out of health. Pretty much the only way to try some of the truly insane stuff people come up with in custom songs.
     
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  46. MDADigital

    MDADigital

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    In our game you can reduce FOV down to a keyhole in size if you want. I would start somewhere equaling a 27" monitor at normal viewing distance and take it up gradually from there.
     
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  47. Martin_H

    Martin_H

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    Are these on by default? I don't remember. I tried Echo and halfway during the tutorial I already wanted to quit from sickness. Pushed through to the end of the tutorial but felt bad for a while afterwards.


    Perfect, that's what I'll have to try then.


    That sounds good. Is it instant in your game or does it move there? I think I'd need it to instantly appear before movement starts and stay till movement fully ended. The one in the game that I tried was neither instant nor fully opaque, so maybe that's why it didn't do that much for me.



    Will do! I heard from a friend this is very impressive. Have you tried the puzzle game in the applab section of sidequest vr? You don't need anything special to access that. It's a puzzle game where you assemble a photogrammetry scan:

    https://sidequestvr.com/app/809/puzzling-places-beta

    At the right viewing distance while looking at a certain part I had a feeling of "this would be the level of detail I'd need for things to start looking "real", but I'd need a higher resolution screen with better black levels too.

    Interesting, I'd have thought smooth rotation is much harder to stomach. Not sure if I tested it yet.
     
  48. MDADigital

    MDADigital

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    Its instant the same frame your start to move it reduces the fov. It's fully opaque. Maybe should make it an option to have it just blur.
     
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  49. bobisgod234

    bobisgod234

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    I got a Quest 2. The screen has definitely improved over the Quest 1. Quest Link works fine with the bundled Quest 1 charging cable (and is probably the reason the Quest 2 charging cable is so much sorter).

    Does anyone feel the strap is worse than the Quest 1? It doesn't seem to fit against my face as well as the Quest 1 did.

    The Facebook account requirement is the worst. When I can't use my grandfathered non-Facebook Oculus account anymore, I am probably going to jump to HTC or something.

    I used the VR Cover silicone cover on the Quest 1. Being silicone, you can just run it under the tap to clean it off. It also has a thing for the nose to block more light. There is one for the Quest 2 (I haven't tried the Quest 2 one, so I can't comment on it specifically).

    https://vrcover.com/item/oculus-quest-2-silicone-cover/
     
  50. neginfinity

    neginfinity

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    In my case, the helmet was on by default, but I don't remember if it had vignettes. Haven't played echo much.

    It is incredibly impressive. It is one of the most promising VR technologies, pretty much. Video version makes it look like pretty much "you are there". Because you can look around and you can move your head a bit. There's loss of details due to compression in distance, but anything before that point feels real.

    And no, I haven't tried the puzzle game.

    Also, try Google Earth for steam when you get PC working. I also recommend to enable "human scale" option there. It is incredibly impressive, even with all those photogrammetry artifacts.

    Well, I don't think the order is important, so enable whatever you prefer first. While I was getting used to it, smooth movement resulted in a gradual build up of nausea. Slow, but steady.
     
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