Need ideas for my co-op RPG game.

Oke so i have been working on a co-op RPG game for quite some time now. And i must say it has come to a point where i need some ideas or some advice. It is a co-op RPG game set in the medeivel area. It has a huge open world, randomly generated dungeon, crafting and material gethering, quests, random loot and skills ofcours. So really i have all the basics of an RPG. But whats next? What would be the top 3-5 features you would like to see in a co-op RPG. And what is the most important part of an RPG game to you?

 

Part of my answer depends on how co-op is implemented. Is it a persistance multiplayer world, where you run around and meet other players? (MMO, but not as 'massive')

Is it a solo world that you can invite a couple friends/strangers to for a dungeon run?

Do we have a central hub of many players, who run off into separate instances of the world with their co-op buddies?

I think at the very least, solid combat and world design are critical to a good co-op RPG. The rest rise and fall in importance depending on how you plan on interacting with other players.

 

You have these features already? If you've got a huge world, random dungeons, crafting, quests, loot, and skills ... then you need to SHIP that puppy and start generating fans.

Gigi

 

What's the core gameplay theme -- or what Jesse Schell in The Art of Game Design might call the "essential experience"?

Coordinating co-op combat?
Building things (crafting items, furnishing houses) with friends?
Sharing a deep story?
Anyone-can-do-anything sandbox?

A good game isn't just features, it's an experience. Your game might have all of the features listed above, but what's the single, primary core idea?

 

The multiplayer is similar to Borderlands if you know that game. The game is designed more or less like a singleplayer game but say you have a hard quest, you can invite your buddy to help you and since there is no real story in the game and the quests are random there is no real issue with spoilers and stuff.

 

The core idea is that you are NOT the hero that was predicted to rise when the dragons returned infact you start out as a thief with nothing but 10copper. Amd that really is the only stroy there is to the game you make your own adventure with your friends. The world is open and free and there are no player/enemy level so you can go any where and time if you have the gear to support your wild plans since some enemy in some areas are stronger then others and there are weapon stats but aslong as you dont go into any dungeons or avoid areas with danger signs you can go anywhere for gameplay minute 1. And make your own story. the NPC will have plenty to do for you.

 

Haha nono its is long from 'ship' ready as the world is mostly done only 1/4 of it is play ready meaning that is has quests items to collect and recources NPC. As far as the dungeon generator goes it is still a little buggy as sometimes it creates a dead end or the boss is unreachable. Also we only have 1 dungeon theme at the moment. Combat is far from done aswell we only have about 15 skills but they are all templates sort or less so we can create a ton more very fast. I'm also still waiting on the 3d artist to create more weapons and at the moment we still have very little armor. Multiplayer needs more testing and i would like to switch to photon. These are just a few things that need to be done. I'm still working on a karma system and NPC AI and lots more stuff i want to add. Now you might say "Then why are you asking for more feature ideas" Well i just would like to hear some ideas for when i need them. I hope for a public alpha in 6months but i still go to school so we'll have to see.

 

Would you say then that the single, primary "essential experience" is completing difficult, randomized quests? Or is it building up your character's stats to be able to tackle those quests? Or is it building your character's story through a string of quests? Or something else?

 

I would say a bit of a combination it is more building your characters personality and stats aswell. There are really difficult quests but it is not a primary goal in the game to complete those. It's more about getting a good house and getting NPC to like you. It is different from anything you have played before you dont NEED to do anything really. Its more about having fun with your friends and making a name for your self.

 

Sounds like fun to me!

 

Sounds like you are listing which aspects of your RPG are most important to focus on

 

Yepp but i would really like to hear some of your thoughts because now we have most of our core features done. And i really like to know what things deffinetly should be added later on so i can plan for them now and see where they fit in in what we already have.

 

Sounds that way to me, too.

Features are a dime a dozen. As players, we're looking for experiences -- things you tell stories about later with your friends, like "Remember in that game, when you built that crazy castle on the edge of the cliff?" or "Remember in that game, when you made all the ladies in that village fall in love with you, and you had to fight their boyfriends?"

You can't manufacture emergent experiences, but you can help them along by providing a consistent core. Minecraft is about creative building. Borderlands is about looting cool gear. Fallout is about wandering the wastes as a badass. You can do lots of other things in these games, but those are the core experiences that make them memorable.

From what you're saying, it sounds like this would be a good building game, where the fun is in building your character and its house. All other activities can support that. For example, quests could involve clearing monsters off land to build your house, or earning money to buy a house in town, or defending your home against invaders, or questing for that perfect ornament to go above your fireplace mantel.

 

As unhelpful as this may sound - focus on the aspects of RPGs that you are trying to emphasize. Housing, character development, NPC interaction. Make them really good. If you try to do everything (especially on an indie budget), you will end up with a hodgepodge of mediocre features that doesn't really have lasting power. Its always tempting to dream out into the future and think about adding every feature imaginable to your game, but you have to be tedious and really polish your core experience to stand out as a memorable RPG, in my mind.

PS: I should really follow my own advice sometimes. I'm currently scope creeping the heck out of my RPG. Time to refocus on the core...

 

That actually is really helpful and i am doing that. I have stop working on to many games because i took to much at once i'm taking it real easy now. And so far its working great. But i still hope for some great ideas just to know what i could do if i see fit. But really tx for the advice.

 

Yupp thats the plan. And me and my friends already have stories like that but they go like this:"Remember that time when we it took us an hour to clear that dungeon because there was a bug that kept spawning mobs and everyone was going all crazy or later on when you got stuck and your character glitched out." It already is fun to play and i love working on it.

 

How about play-tests? Building more features might be less productive than extensive play tests. Play testing will expose 90% of what you need to focus on next - which, might be something like, "Simpler" or "Funner".

Gigi

 

The voice of reason.

I approve.

 

Where do I sign up for playtesting? *grins*

Joking aside, that might just be the bit of boost you need if you already have the 'core' in place. It might be easier for folks to give you constructive input if you can show what you have created and then give them the opportunity to give you some feedback on what works well and what does not, along with ideas for new elements/improvements.

 

Unique Weapons and Attributes. Upgradeable. Oh and some kind of treasure chests. Enemies would be great too. And a beautiful sunrise and sunset. That right there can make or break the game and is how you get a reviewer to mention "it is now midnight and I just witnessed the most glorious sunrise ever".

 

if I was asked to choose in a vacuum, story for me. though each of those elements can add something to the game experience, so... all of em

but reading your own post on the main theme of this game so far, I'd say work on the bit you want the game t stand out on, which was the housing and npc interaction. because, as has been said here a few times now, features are a dime a dozen so picking those doesn't matter so much a building the games experience. and you already know what experience you want

also, this sounds fun, give us a call if you need playtesters

 

Yea i will though i will probably use my friends for that so i have a good overview of whats going on.

 

I mostly agree with Zaladur but here is where I totally contradict his logic and as a designer you should probably not listen because....
"It would be awesome if"
A core game play mechanic was co-op fighting - battling against enemies.
Imagine DMC or God of War co-op! That would be pretty interesting and sounds fun to me. Like juggling battling co-op moves and attacks.

Wait - that God of War assension is multi-player isnt it? I never played that so I dont know what type of game play it has.

I dont believe Ive ever played a co-op RPG. I played Borderlands with my son but it really wasnt a co-op experience that felt like we were helping each other.

 

This reminds me of Ultima Online, I spent so much time in that game hunting deers so that I could sell their pelts just to make enough money to buy decorations for my house. I think in the 3 years that I played this game all in all I went through 2 or 3 dungeons. The rest was hunting with friends, decorating my house and of course increasing my avatar's skills.

I love games that don't have a sense of urgency like Mount & Blade or Skyrim (at some point) where it's not a quest book that tells you what to do. You just pick a direction and go there see what's up. Which is why I listed World Design and Freedom as my most beloved features of any RPG.

 

Urgency in Skyrim? That's one thing I enjoyed about it. Dragons were coming back, destroying the world. And I as the DragonBorn, the one person who could stop this, was off learning how to pick locks, or stalking deer, or any number of other distractions in that game, just for the fun of it. I never did finish the main quest.

 

Yes which is why after 800 hours clocked in I only did the main quest once. I like to think that I'm part of a world, not that I'm the only who can save it.

 

Sorry, I missed the "don't have" in your post. I'm going to quietly pretend that post never happened. Lack of urgency is great, especially if the game has relevant things to do in the down time.

 

World Building: The mix of story, lore and world-design.
The master of the art: Fallout

Second come quests and combat.

As for the coop factor:
Ask yourself whether you want to make "a coop game" or "a real coop game".

 

For other Id say bosses

 

Agreed! Also, bosses that make you strive to fight and kill them because you want to, not because the game tells you to.
Example: They lead a gang of looters that keep breaking into the house you're trying to build and stealing all your cookies!

 

Need I mention that the cookies is definitely an important aspect of any coop game. Without cookies your game will be dead in the water.

 

...But you are the only one who can save it! You eat dragon's souls like pudding. How do they taste?

 

It doesn't need saving if you avoid the western watchtower

 

Actually if you avoid looting the key item from the boss of Bleak Fall's Barrow. You can also avoid it by not taking the stone back to Farengar. I think one way or another, if you talk to Yarl Baalgruuf, you'll still be roped into the main storyline mission, though.

 

I've said Combat System, because I feel thats been a huge gap in your traditional RPG. The traditional ways are getting very old, wheres the twitch RPG, wheres the nidhogg styled combat.

 

Could we also have cake? Cake + cookies == "We're out of milk!"
Gigi

 

For me, the most important part of any RPG are those innovative features which, when strung together, really create a unique experience. I still enjoy Fallout 1 & 2 because of that very reason. Even 18 years later, its features are innovative and fresh. Some games I love borrow heavily from that game two decades old. (Dead State, for example has a Fallout style world map & world travel. I loved that feature, it immersed me greatly.) Dead State is a great example of innoation. They took the tradition turn based rpg, and added in a huge focus on the Shelter (Home Base). Something you rarely see in survival games. Imagine if Fallout had done this one feature- it would be a transformed game.

If it were me, I'd work on adding some overly complex feature which immediately complicates game development, pushing the release date significantly. Either because the feature is untested (may or may not be "fun", needing lots of iterations or scrapping) or because it is complex (the more complex, the more you're on your own figuring things out, the harder it is, the more you find out why no one else has tried similar features before)...or both.

From a game dev perspective, it sounds like a ticket straight into the poor house, but I've been a hardcore gamer for decades- so most things bore me to death. I find I always want to cater first to the "hardcore" crowd who have seen it all before (which is quite difficult to accomplish, since all the easier features are already done time and time again), then cater second to the game dev crowd who beg you to just release something quickly (which is more practical advice).

To keep it simple, instead of making a game whose features sound like nothing new, I'd pair crazy sounding ideas, like Skyrim + Dwarf Forress, or at least take a game which HAS been done before but has NOT been cloned before, Like Neo Scavenger, then adding a Dinosaur Theme. Working from there can make some interesting ideas which can lead to major or minor features. Even if it's just one feature (even a minor one) if it greatly enhanced the experience or transforms it- giving the game its own...uniqueness.... that might very well be interesting enough to try

I just thoroughly enjoy those games which give you that depth. Many bigger studios make great games because of the story/world building/content, but that requires a lot of resources many smaller/newer teams don't have. That is why I try for the depth instead. I'm more 'resourced' at making say, a Dwarf Fortress, than a Telltale Game.

 

Same here. I played UO for years, and probably barely scratched the surface. What an amazing game.

Freedom is pretty awesome in RPG's, and IMO a requirement.

If I want story, I'll play a Point & Click which have significantly more awesme and fulfilling stories than a RPG. Not to mention you can FINISH the story before getting bored. (Old school Point & clicks, Telltale games, etc.)

Even so, I could just watch a movie or another incredible TV series for my dramatic needs. Video game stories, with the exceptions of point & clicks, tend to have stupid or dull stories. At least, nothing all that interesting to me compared to my love for the alternatives I listed.

Freedom can mean a lot too. There are games where the freedom was not in the world, but in the character or gameplay.

For example, any superhero MMO. The freedom was in the character you created, the powers you chose, the travel ability you had. The actual gameplay (quests) were repetitive and boring. Well, most anyway (just reskins of the same quest over and over, with random themed enemies).

Most of my favorite games give freedom: Fallout, Skyrim, Dont Starve, Neo Scavenger or other indie games, The Escapists, etc. YOU get to decide what to do.

Most importantly though are games which allow you the HOW you will do it. Fallout let you make a pacifist, a scientist, not an exclusive combatant. Neo Scavenger lets you attempt various skills that have little to do with combat. The Escapists let you try multiple avenues of escape. Part of the fun was analysizing the prison and beginning your strategy (what you thought was best).

Then again, I honestly just love alternatives to combat. Combat is so overdone, it is the least interesting mechanic IMO. I'd much rather play a scientist or a tradesman.