Search Unity

  1. Megacity Metro Demo now available. Download now.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. Unity support for visionOS is now available. Learn more in our blog post.
    Dismiss Notice

Need help with core mechanics

Discussion in 'Game Design' started by Vefery, Nov 21, 2020.

  1. Vefery

    Vefery

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2018
    Posts:
    119
    The idea of my game is: 2-4 players enter a haunted area and have to banish a ghost from there. To do this they should find out type of the ghost. During this the ghost wanders around and do things (none of them are harmful).
    Initially I had an idea of a level of sanity; if player sees/hears ghost's action, they lose sanity, if sanity reaches zero, player gets locked in a fear animation until someone rescue him.
    The problem is that when I showed this concept to my friends they said that this mechanic doesn't have thrill and tension, the ghost isn't a real threat and I need to make it actually harmful and punishing for mistakes. But I can't think of any way to harm player without "typical horror chasing AI". Please give me any ideas to improve the ghost mechanics
     
    YBtheS likes this.
  2. JoeStrout

    JoeStrout

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2011
    Posts:
    9,859
    I think you need new friends. :p

    Just kidding! But I do think you should stick to your guns here. There are plenty of horror games already, and making the ghost harmful and punishing to create thrill and tension just dumps you in with the rest of that lot. Whereas a ghost puzzle game is something pretty unique. Your friends can't picture it because they've never seen it, which may mean you're on to something new.

    One of my favorite games at the moment is Opus Magnum, a game in which you build alchemical machines. When you do it wrong, your machine doesn't work, and you try again. There is no punishment, no harm, and no "tension" or "thrill," but tons of fun. (See here for my theory about fun.)
     
    angrypenguin, YBtheS and Vefery like this.
  3. Vefery

    Vefery

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2018
    Posts:
    119
    Talked with my friend and it turned out we misunderstood each other a bit and they thought the goal of my game was a bit different:D
    Tho It gave me an idea to make this mechanic hybrid: some ghost scare, some harm
    So the original question is still open
     
  4. Joe-Censored

    Joe-Censored

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2013
    Posts:
    11,847
    My first reaction is I didn't like this part. People don't like it in games and movies when characters they are attached to do things they think aren't at all logical or don't make much sense. If you go crazy from fear, then running in a panic makes more sense than being frozen. I can imagine just getting mad at the game as I'm stuck. "What are you F'ing afraid of! OMG stuck again!" is probably something I'd yell at my screen. :p The player is more likely to feel bored than fear.

    So I might instead just start adding motion blur and tunnel vision, with some heart pounding sound louder than the environment. Make it more difficult to play. Maybe even have the character have some erratic movement to simulate a panic. Maybe have the character accidentally drop items. You tell the character to move forward, and instead it turns and runs a few paces down a hallway. That kind of thing.
     
    SparrowGS, YBtheS and Vefery like this.
  5. angrypenguin

    angrypenguin

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2011
    Posts:
    15,614
    Wait, you showed it to just one person and you're already trying to figure out what to do with the feedback? Don't!

    Keep showing it to new people. Ideally, show it to people who aren't your friends to remove that bias. And once you've got feedback from enough people that you're seeing consistent trends in it, then figure out what to do with it.

    Moreover, not every game has to be for every person. If your one friend just happens to like horror / action games then their feedback is just going to reflect that. And that's fine... if you're making the game for people like them. If you're trying to make something different then their feedback is useless to you, because it won't represent the needs or desires of the people who are into the thing you actually want to make.

    So...
    Agreed, at least enough to see if there are people who are into it for what it is.
     
    Vefery likes this.
  6. Devastadus

    Devastadus

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2015
    Posts:
    80
    Execution is more important then ideas. I'm sure the original idea for super Mario was super weird and people didn't understand. mushrooms making you grow. flowers making you shoot fireballs. If you told me super Mario in a pitch i would think it would suck. You need to create a prototype and flesh it out. All ideas suck first but if your passionate about it. it will come together.
     
    Kazen, JoeStrout and Vefery like this.
  7. BrandyStarbrite

    BrandyStarbrite

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2013
    Posts:
    2,074
    Exactly.
     
    Vefery likes this.
  8. SparrowGS

    SparrowGS

    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2017
    Posts:
    2,536
    You could maybe do a "damsel in distress" type deal here if you don't want the player to be killable by the player but still have lose conditions and urgency.

    Have the ghost actually go after the damsel you need to rescue and you trying to get to the damsel before the ghost do kills/posseses/whatever to her (or get to the ghost and eliminate it before it eliminates the damsel if you wanna make that a thing)
    That way when you're paralyzed you know the ghost is making progress and you're just frozen (or out of control panicking like some have suggested), how to get the fear mechanic to not feel frustrating like Joe said is besides my point here.


    from what I get the "original" urgency and lose condition are when all players are in the fear state (so they can't rescue each other), maybe if you could flesh this side of things a bit more?
    like how this all works mechanically, i image just a re-skinned injured solider and medic scenario here, how is this different?
     
    Vefery likes this.
  9. yzRambler

    yzRambler

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2019
    Posts:
    37
    Maybe you can setup an region around the goast. The locking will be triggered just as the player enter in it.
     
  10. BIGTIMEMASTER

    BIGTIMEMASTER

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2017
    Posts:
    5,181
    whether the ghost makes a character scream and faint or explode into gooey chunks isn't really that important. That's just theme. The gameplay result is the same. The decisions player has to make are the same. It's the perceived risk that builds tension. Not the animations.


    FWIW, I think abstract things like "sanity" tend to go better with hardcore strategy type of games, more than casual multiplayer party games. If you wanted to keep the game PG then I think having the ghost say "boo" and then character screams and faints is pretty cute. I don't think making it violent adds anything, unless you want to go for a different theme/audience. But regardless of theme the gameplay is the same.
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2021
    SparrowGS and angrypenguin like this.
  11. SparrowGS

    SparrowGS

    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2017
    Posts:
    2,536
    You can do a mechanic where you need to help the "injured" player ger over the fear that paralyzed him.
    That's why i asked hiw is this different from a medic situ.
     
  12. yzRambler

    yzRambler

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2019
    Posts:
    37

    "It's the perceived risk that builds tension. Not the animations."
    I think so.
    Meanwhile, it's necessary to make a distinction between the avater' action and player sense.
    The avater's action is just a image and precomputed of the desinger.
    If the player play the game time after time, his sense will change in same occasion.
     
  13. BIGTIMEMASTER

    BIGTIMEMASTER

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2017
    Posts:
    5,181
    I simplified for the sake of making a point, but certainly the art and animations makes a big impact on players psyche.
     
    angrypenguin likes this.
  14. yzRambler

    yzRambler

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2019
    Posts:
    37
    Sorry, I need fix a word for more precise expression.
    It's avater's behaviour instead of avater's action.
    While the designer figure out the avater will present shocked state in some time, he maybe think whether the player is boring.
     
  15. Rin-Dev

    Rin-Dev

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2014
    Posts:
    574
    You should look at Phasmaphobia. They handle this concept pretty well. You might be able to build off of it and figure out what to do differently.
     
  16. BrandyStarbrite

    BrandyStarbrite

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2013
    Posts:
    2,074
    Check out a game on nintendo gamecube, called Eternal Darkness. That game has some really neat sanity to insanity mechanics. Sometimes the game would play tricks on you, making you think you died in the game.
     
    Vefery likes this.