Search Unity

Loss of JavaScript Support = No More Public Higher Ed Courses Unless Instructor Has M.S. in C.S.

Discussion in 'Community Learning & Teaching' started by ewilde-srjc, Nov 20, 2017.

  1. ewilde-srjc

    ewilde-srjc

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2017
    Posts:
    2
    I have taught design-focused students Unity using JavaScript nee UnityScript for more than five years now. Unity was the go-to authoring replacement app for Adobe Flash when it lost favor. Both authoring tools allow "scripting" students who are art-focused to actually prototype and author interactive experiences.

    On 8/11/2017, a Unity blog posted the news that JavaScript support would be fading away in subsequent releases of Unity. This date preceded my Fall semester Game Development 1 course that dictated in the official course outline that JavaScript be used. I proceeded to use Unity, even as 2017.2 vanished the JavaScript choice from the script component authoring UI. Many students dropped my course as they learned the news that JS support was leaving Unity.

    I spent the first 17 years of teaching in higher education working in a private design school. Last year I moved to a public school of higher ed in California. I have learned about many differences in the requirements and protocols in my new role as a public instructor of higher education. One of the things I have learned is that the California Education Code – state law mind you – mandates that instructors of courses using programming languages such as C, C#, C++ hold Masters degrees in Computer Science. In contrast, scripting languages such as JavaScript, ECMAScript, PHP, etc. can be taught by instructors who do not hold a M.S. in C.S.

    Long and short of it: classes that taught Unity in community colleges, CSU and UC campuses will have to identify instructors who hold M.S. degrees to continue teaching Unity. Most schools at the community college level (114 campuses in CA) find instructors with M.S. degrees in C.S. in short supply, and they are already overcommitted to the fundamental programming courses needed for transfer students.

    Meanwhile, there are many JavaScript-based game engines (Phaser.js to name one) that existing instructors will adopt in place of Unity, even though the feature sets are different.

    I am not necessarily here to complain but did want to share my insights since Unity has been such a valuable tool to my past students.

    Sincerely,
    Ethan Wilde
    Lead Faculty: Web / Mobile / Gaming
    Santa Rosa Junior College
    ewilde@santarosa.edu
     
  2. Owen-Reynolds

    Owen-Reynolds

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2012
    Posts:
    1,998
    That's interesting about JavaScript in the syllabus. I worked for colleges (1 state, 1 private,) and "everyone" knew the Course Description must be vague. Never mention a specific tool or language, since you'll be stuck with it.

    Also funny about scripting languages vs. "real" ones. It's always been a mushy distinction. PERL is considered a scripting language, but it's in no way easy. And C# is used as a scripting language in microsoft's ASP web page framework (it directly replaces the javascript you'd be writing.)

    You could make an argument that Unity clearly uses scripts, therefore C# is a scripting language in that context. I'm seeing the K-12 proposal: https://www.cde.ca.gov/be/st/ss/compsciguidelines.asp. Point 11 is being language agnostic. Then point 6 is to reflect trends in the industry. I'd say Unity (which is well-known enough to count as "the industry") switching to C# is one of those trends.

    As for student excitement. Did they associate unity javascript with web page design? I feel like those don't transfer very much. The course is called "Game Design I"? I have trouble imagining a kid excited about a game design class, but only if it uses language X. Part of the reason for the switch to C# is it's a mainstream language. Kids probably have an Aunt who uses it. Job postings request it. Often little rumors can start that make no sense. Maybe some former students can help track them down.
     
    Sonnenspeer likes this.
  3. ewilde-srjc

    ewilde-srjc

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2017
    Posts:
    2
    Owen-Reynolds,
    Thanks for your posting. I should clarify that the issue comes up in higher education code, not for grades 1-12, which is the audience for the document you linked.

    While we can agree that C# implementation in Unity is a "scripting" implementation, the C# language is not treated as a scripting language in higher education curricula.

    We can also agree that the distinction between scripting and programming is mushy, a word choice of yours that I really like for this description.
     
  4. Owen-Reynolds

    Owen-Reynolds

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2012
    Posts:
    1,998
    My point was the K-12 computing guidelines were the closest I could find. In my time teaching at a State school (but not in CA,) I never heard of state guidelines. I was told to follow the topics, which were consistent with ACM guidelines, however I thought best. The one accreditor seemed pretty reasonable, even for something I was doing "wrong."

    I can see the reason for that rule - we don't want computer programming 1 being taught by someone without a Masters(*). But the rule shows they're flexible - a Master's is negotiable for some classes. A more common rule is you simply need one. Is the class _teaching_ programming (or is "some familiarity with coding" a prereq?) What percent is programming (probably pretty low.) Is it cross-listed in the Design school catalogue? What does the rule actually say? How has it been enforced previously, if ever?

    (*) We probably also don't want C# as a 1st language. It has the same problems as Java, which schools are now rejecting. My "C# using Unity" book is awkward in the classes and pointers section - more awkward than when I taught the same thing in C++. I'm wondering how C# made it to that list. In theory it would by taught as a 1-credit elective by someone from industry.
     
  5. Selzier

    Selzier

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2014
    Posts:
    652
    If someone sent me their resume and they only had JavaScript experience as a Unity developer, I would tell them to get lost.

    Remember these people are going into a plethora of debt, so they can be hired.
     
  6. Owen-Reynolds

    Owen-Reynolds

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2012
    Posts:
    1,998
    Selzier, in a public university the students taking a Game Design course are generally majoring in Design/Architecture or Computer Science. With luck you get a mix of all skills. It's often an elective with an emphasis on project management skills. You may be thinking of one of those for-profit game design schools.

    As far as hiring, my understanding was for game design _programmers_ you generally want a Com Science background. Then for level designers and so forth you're looking for just creativity, drive and so on. They probably know some coding, but the mere fact they know the basics in any language is all you might care about.
     
  7. AGaming

    AGaming

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2013
    Posts:
    103
    In fact, it's sad that "Unity" refuses from javascript. Although they say that almost no use of javascript, I personally think this is a lie. A lot of polls show that javascript takes either the first or second place in the world.