Kickstarter is officially dead to me,

Yea, never going on the site again after seeing this

 

This thread is officially dead to me.

...Until I found it actually did have a link to something, lol.

 

You actually support a woman scamming people out of thousands of dollars?

 

¿Really?
I'm not sure... This looks like a easy way to get money. They already got $20k, so...
- $829 = "RPG Camp"?
- ~$500-700 = New Laptop.
- $70 = RPG Make VX Ace.
So... ~$19k left. 5 Days of crowfunding...
Damn... that's a lot of money.

 

It gets worse, http://h13.abload.de/img/1364168115669gafg5.png

 

Seriously, Kickstarter needs something like the AppStore: QA.
But anyway, I think this thread is done
Any mod?

 

If people are backing it, who cares?

Its the people backing it's business.... End of story

 

People are not being forced or tricked into funding projects. I've seen plenty of projects on Kickstarter that I would never, personally fund, but we don't dictate things like that.

On IndieGoGo, some people raised millions of dollars to send an old lady on vacation. So what! People can give their money to whomever they want, and support whatever they want.

 

Look a the picture (http://h13.abload.de/img/1364168115669gafg5.png), seems a bit suspicious.

 

That's not what I'm mad about it, it's the fact that this woman has enough money to buy everyone in here and is running to kickstarter to buy a mac(which is against Kickstarter's guidelines in the first place.)

 

It is also kind of depressing she has raised so much more than other projects that have put their lives into their work ~_~

 

Look you understand two people can have the same name.

 

That's like saying you won't buy anything off eBay or Amazon again after somebody had put up an item for a ridiculously high price you didn't agree with.

Quoted for emphasis.

 

Oh, there's the link. I thought you just made a comment with no link or other information. My bad... unless you edited the link in after I made my comment.

 

I thought the same as others with a different view. I cannot hold Kickstarter.com responsible for democracizing funding and having a few bad eggs appear. There will always by projects with different levels of quality. It's sort of the point. You get to pick.

DXCam are you saying you would never fund anyone else, or are you also closing the door on yourself for using the platform for any work you may want funding with? I see the difference, if someone else's shady actions made me shady by proxy or it was contagious then ok, I would stay away. But I see No relevance to someone else's actions and my own therefore KS stay's a viable "option" when and if I'm ready or need it.

 

well guys you should all have a 9yo daughter wanting make rpg hahaha...to get some cash from ks xD....

 

Did anyone else noticed that woman ("mother of the year") let her 9 year old play Dragon Age II??

"My favorite PS3 game right now is Dragon Age II."

Incase you don't know - Dragon Age II's ESRB rating is for MATURE (17+) AUDIENCE ONLY.
There are enough Blood, Gore, Foul Language, Sexual Content, and Violence content to warrant this rating.

http://www.esrb.org/ratings/synopsis.jsp?Certificate=30575


Oh and the dad is superb too.

"I love computers, video games, apps, and role playing games - especially Magic the Gathering and Borderlands 2 that I get to play with my Dad (because my 15 16 year old brothers are too mean to play with me)."

Oh I dunno, maybe the reason her "mean" ol' 15 16 year old brothers who won't play those game with her because they got brains to read the box on the game that says :


Borderlands 2:
Rating : M (17+)
Content Descriptors: Blood and Gore, Intense Violence, Language, Sexual Themes, Use of Alcohol

http://www.esrb.org/ratings/synopsis.jsp?Certificate=32333



Wonderful parenting I must say. Wonderful.

 

Whats everyone complaining about we found the secret to kickstarter success, a cute mascot is all you need everyone should have there children "front" there game and if you don't have children well just use a pet or something, My kitty is going to front my game lol

 

Wow, this is a bit of kick in the nads for all those genuine game devs who didn't make enough money via kickstarter.

The human race are a strange bunch...

 

Does one of the guys T's say "Think I'm Lesbian"?

 

Kickstarter is Pinterest with bigger numbers and more tech. Scams, money grabs, crap projects with insane budget requests, big companies hitting it up on already established games that dont need it and the indie flake train that never seems to end flock to kickstarter.

I've seen several really great projects there, but they're also getting scrutinized unfortunately, and even after using KS still need to do a ton of marketing to pull through. Just disappointed in where it's gone recently.

 

I can see where the anger comes from but:
- Every project on Kickstarter trys to exploit its system to: make money.
- Success of a project is proportional to the sympathy of the backers and not to the quality or honesty of the idea.

This kickstarter has nothing to do with game making. It's about the kid. And of course this kickstarter is more successfull then most indie games:
- Percentage of kickstarter users which are gamers and would consider backing a game: Low.
- Percentage of kickstarter users which like kids or even are parents themselves: High.

Its simple... most people would spend money to help out a little kid but wouldn't spend money on "another random indie game".

 

Hahaha, are some of you people seriously defending what is a actual abuse of more than half the kickstarter rules?

 

The father 'has collected comics since he was a child – which means we have stacks of pristine white boxes filled with comics in plastic sleeves hidden in a closet.' why don't these parents sell a few of those to raise the money to send their kid on this trip?

 

Why spend your money when someone else is willing to spend their money for you.

 

This kickstarter is extra cool. I'm supporting it. No Joke.

 

It's not "cool", it's a scam and a violation of the ToS. There's actually valid reasons to question whether or not this daughter even exists considering S*** like this.

The entire thing was written by the mother, who now has one of her friends calling people who disagree with the project "misogynists" on Twitter. Not only that, but the mother CLEARLY has the money to put her daughter into this program on her own. This is a complete disgrace to kickstarter and crowdfunding in general, especially considering how overfunded it is.

 

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/623745679/948103832?token=3fa62ca3

 

Let them be, resistance is futile.

Support kickstarter or don't, but there's no need for a big drama.

 

fraud
/frôd/
Noun
Wrongful or criminal deception intended to result in financial or personal gain.

That kickstater project screams it, just look at the facts as posted before: http://h13.abload.de/img/1364168115669gafg5.png (The one reply on the project page has the same image / photo as that of the "Fortune top 10 individual" if that's even true to begin with

Won't abandon the site, just these sorts of projects are getting out of hand.

 

Even if everything about this Kickstarter is completely, 100% legitimate - it's still a clear violation of the terms of service. I'll be very surprised if it's not removed before ending, especially considering how much it's blowing up on sites like Reddit (bad PR for Kickstarter is bad PR for thousands of business).

 

How is it a violation of the TOS?

1. Funding for projects only.

Check - it's a game.

2. Projects must fit Kickstarter’s categories.

Check - it's a game.

3. Prohibited uses: No charity or cause funding. No "fund my life" projects. No prohibited uses (pornography, etc).

Check - it's an RPG game.

Looks like it passes all of the Terms of Service.

 

Wrong. It's for a camp.

Wrong again.

No, it doesn't because you didn't actually look at what the project was or apparently how that applied to the ToS.

 

Try looking at the image someone actually posted.
http://h13.abload.de/img/1364168115669gafg5.png

 

Sorry, that's blocked where I am at. What does it show? That the family is eating caviar out of diamond-encrusted glasses whilst driving around in Lamborghini's? Or a bunch of college boys posting the kickstarter while laughing about the fools that back it?

At face value, the kickstarter looks good to me. A 9 year old is making a game with her mom, due to be delivered in June. So it will be bad, I could care less.

 

It shows that the mum is a "Fortune Top Ten Entrepreneur", whatever that is, runs $100 million companies, makes millions off domain squatting and buys $1,700 shoes. Yet needs to start a kickstarter to send her kid on a $829 training camp and buy a laptop. The image also clearly points out how she is violating Kickstarter's terms of use.

 

It actually shows that she's wealthy, owns her own crowdfunding website for ONLY FEMALES. (Why not use that? I mean part of her reason for this is to get more females into STEM).

The kick starter and all the proof gathered screams abuse. It's just too much to list. She's abusing gender issues to get funding for this project and I love how she is exploiting her sons for her 9 year old daughters benefit.

 

Just enough to fund the mothers failed kickstarter from last year for making capes

Really not sure about this. On the one hand I applaud young people getting into game development and being constructive with their time, on the other this seems somewhat exploitive in so many ways (pulling on heart strings, sympathy etc). What will make it worse for those who see this as having no place on kickstarter is that it will likely end up hugely over funded due to both of these points.

Of course we should expect a flood of similar kickstarters in the next few days (unless KS change there T C) and a backlash against them. It would be tempting to see this as a 'beginning of the end' of kickstarter, but I doubt that will happen. I've always felt there is a natural balance in KS, so whilst some 'kid' projects will be funded, sometimes way in excess of their goal, the majority will simply fail.

This is one case where I have a feeling KS will have to make a change to their T&C as it could be seen to make a mockery of their aims and T&C. No one would deny this kid the opportunity to go to camp to make an RPG, or that its a creative use of KS and for that reason despite the apparently accurate claims that the T&C have already be broken many times I doubt it will be pulled.

However the potentially exploitive nature of such a Kickstarter (even if people are happy to pledge) would I think suggest a change needed for T&C. For example the mother had one for making capes last year, she raised $450 on a $20k goal, whilst her daughter has raised $21k in a few days of a $900 goal. Does that mean projects from now on will tag on a child (if appropriate) to garner additional attention or sympathy? A simple change such as a limit to the goal (and no over-funding) for anything related to a child/children being directly funded, but note I do mean directly, I do not mean for the funding of projects that benefit children.

Then again i'm kinda of surprised this got through the approvals process in the first place, since I would guess the age limit for creators was put in place for exactly this situation (and others). Although they get around it by having them as a co-creator I would have thought this went against the spirit of the T&C and would have thus been flagged?

I'd like to say that this is a questionable project, when compared to what you would expect on KS, but really its not (ignoring braking of current T&C). Pledges are still receiving a product at the end and though I doubt it will be very good, questionable value of a product has always been allowed. People are free to pledge to whatever cause/project they like, its their money, neither us nor KS have any responsibility to prevent them, other than clearly fraudulent projects. Other popular projects exceed their goals too, so that shouldn't be a problem either.

Yet ultimately something just doesn't sit properly with me about this.

Will be very interesting to see what happens, what Kickstarter does, if anything, how many similar projects crop up in the next week or so (how long does it take for approval?) etc.

 

Read the highest pledge you can make and tell me your opinion on that. And I agree with all of the things you said. But that pledge is the exact opposite of what kickstarter is about(Not to mention that is 10x the amount she originally wanted).

 

Yeah, after looking over some of this, I've changed my perspective. While I'll certainly defend any legit project on KS, this is not one of them. This is clearly a scam put together by the mother.

Not only do I have doubts that this alleged "little girl" even wants to make a game, it is also a blatant violation of Kickstarters ToS. Beyond the fact that the family COULD easily pay for this themselves, but they also SHOULD pay for this themselves. If you want your kid to go to summer camp, dip into your own, multi-million dollar savings.

 

lol - I was going to check that, but the page happened to be on that part that showed the awards, just above the final bit about 'Risks and challenges' and it had the $100 jacket, which I figured would be the maximum pledge, after all 9 of those and you got your funding, no need for higher ones, right?

So yeah that is taking the biscuit.

Point is that are several different debates brought on by this kickstarter, at least in my mind, all of them worthwhile and equal in importance. I decided to focus on the actual project, but as you and others have pointed out there are the issues with TOS be broken, questionable project with high reward teirs, questionable project as with regards to the mother - is this some experiment? Not to mention the fact that it would appear that the parents should easily be able to fund this themselves.

However if I addressed all that you'd have a wall of text longer than that dubious 'PR' quote posted by a newbie in the 'Universe' project thread here recently

I do feel with further reading about the other issues that the project is likely to be pulled. Not doing so (in my opinion) would cause worse PR than leaving it up now for KS.

However I also feel that its a shame that such a project has caused such a bad reaction, as although there are very questionable elements, and maybe the actual project this time is too far towards 'fund my life', I would hate to see worthwhile projects from parents and their children be permanently scared or even prevented. If anything that would be the real travesty/legacy of this.

 

I would love to fund a legit project being developed by a young kid... maybe. My son is very much into gaming, and if he wanted to start developing games, I'd be giddy. However, buying him a laptop and sending him to camp is my responsibility; its not what Kickstarter is for.

 

True, to a degree, but then the problem with 'absolutes' like that who would be worthy of a kickstarter? Many projects up to $10k or more could easily be considered the same, most people could fund that if they saved for a few years. Many kickstarter game projects i've seen a chunk of the funding goal goes towards hardware, so why should it be different for kids and parents?

Whilst I can appreciate your point here and would agree that in the main parents should be able to fund this themselves or even why does a kid need a laptop, most people have a computer these days, however i'm not sure its a line you can draw without being biased to many other creators?

 

Its not even that. The laptop is only one issue. The main goal of the funding, however, is to send this girl to an "RPG Camp". That is a direct violation of the Terms of Service, and should absolutely be paid for by the parents.

 

A lot of the comments on here seem hurt that someone that does have, or has had in the past, some sort of financial solvency is using Kickstarter. As if Kickstarter is only for people who have no cash, like it's some sort of charity for struggling game developers.
I don't believe that is the case, and nothing in the TOS or marketing materials even hints that.

 

I don't think that "RPG Camp" classifies as tuition. This is directly related to the girl making a game. I don't understand the anger from some folk on this, it seems unwarranted.

 

You sure love moving goalposts, huh? The problem is that she's shamelessly violating the Kickstarter ToS on multiple levels AND has MORE than enough money to cover this $850 cost. On top of that, she runs her own crowdfunding site for women only in the first place where this would have been more appropriate. To add to those two previous things, there are numerous dubious things about this kickstarter in the first place.

It's paying money for education. This is the literal definition of tuition.

 

Whoever funding her are probably terrorists who want 9 year olds to make RPG...




"Check out my RPG Bro!"

 

Not at all. The fact that they have enough money, and the fact that they run their own crowd funding site are just despicable traits, but not against the ToS. However, it is clearly a "pay for my life/education" campaign, which IS against the ToS.