Just starting out and wondered if Python is a good choice or plain ridiculous

I am an entrepreneur and have some experience in I.T but I'm an absolute beginner when it comes to Game Development. I studied IT in college and some of the courses I had to take were C, C#, and stuff like HTML, JS. I am not a programmer. Those languages didn't sink in very well when I studied them in college but now looking back at all of the tutorials and books, I am getting a better grasp of programming. Nonetheless, I don't think I am ready to fully take on C# or anything C related, as they are fairly advanced and complicated.

I like the idea of Python, it's simple and I have seen fun and fair quality games developed entirely using Python. I just don't know if Unity 5 supports it and if it's friendly to anything else other than C# and JS (which I hear people use in Unity)

I would like to develop games like Race the Sun, Terraria, Tales of Maj'Eyal and other RPG and retro like games with awesome gameplay which probably requires a powerful engine as well as a powerful programming language.

Will you please direct me as to where I should start? I already chose Unity 5 as my engine. I need to figure out which programming language to use (I hear some developers use more than one in a game, how does that work?) If you do highly recommend to man up and study C# then will you please tell me what is the best way to approach C#? Should I study JS first? Is there a favorite website or YouTube channel you'd recommend?

I have marvelous ideas for games, realistic ideas even for a beginner and I am professional when it comes to business and marketing. I just need to learn how to program, draw and design a logical game.

I highly appreciate your constructive criticism and any helpful comments.

 

Pythons not a good choice for working with Unity. Mainly because you can't use python in Unity. Not without jumping through a maze of hoops.

Don't bother with Unity's version of JavaScript. If you want to use Unity learn C#.

The other alternative is a visual code system like PlayMaker.

 

Thank you very much for the quick and informative reply. I guess C# it is. I am a bit afraid of tackling it again but I guess I don't have much of a choice.

 

Unity 5 technically supports Boo, which has a similar syntax to Python, but it's no longer possible to create Boo scripts directly in Unity, and the docs don't have Boo examples anymore. So while Boo is still usable it's not really the best choice for a beginner.

Realistically the options are Unityscript and C#. Note that Unityscript is not Javascript (despite being called that officially), it's a custom language. It's perfectly feasible to use Unityscript, though, and I'd recommend it for general Unity programming since it's typically less arcane and more straightforward than C#. I think most people who push C# don't really remember what it's like to be a new programmer. (e.g., it may seem like a trivial thing to experienced programmers, but I've seen C#'s lack of a 'function' keyword cause no end of confusion to newbies where they don't understand what's going on and refer to functions as 'voids'.) The only problem is that most of the new teaching material uses C#.

--Eric

 

Thank you very much for this great reply! So are you saying Unityscript is not a frowned upon language? Is it powerful and diverse enough? Also, is it only usable within Unity3D or can I use it outside Unity3D? Will it help me grasp C# better if I start out with UnityScript? Or should I just man up and tackle C# one step at a time? I just know that C# isn't child's play and it will take some time before I could incorporate my C# knowledge into game development. With C# you gotta take your time and learn all the ropes before tackling a project like a game. I remember programming very simple programs with C#. Oh my... Hundreds lines of code and I got lost within them sometimes. I hope I am not a lose cause when it comes to programming. I am OK with IT. So I think my brain should be able to grasp it.


I am thinking to take this course: https://www.coursera.org/course/gameprogramming
It applies to Unity and BEGINNER C# Programming. They have professors from fine institutes and it's free. At the end of it I can also get a certificate of completion so why not.

 

For some people it is, but you can ignore them.

For most things, sure. It does have some limitations and hasn't been actively developed for a while.

As I said, it's a custom language. It's not called "Unityscript" for nothing. Although it's strongly similar to ActionScript 3 from Flash; anyone familiar with one could pick up the other in a very short time. (Just FYI, Unity is named Unity and not Unity3D.)

Probably, or at least it did for me.

Whatever works for you.

--Eric

 

There is IronPython, Python for .NET.

Don't see why this shouldn't work with Unity...

 

Once again, thank you so much Eric! I know my questions were a tad obnoxious. I am just a bit startled by C# but I guess I have no choice but keep trying.

I will definitely check that out. I would LOVE to start with Python and become more comfortable at programming before I tackle C#. Object Oriented Programming is something I would love to know, I just think it's not a first step. First I should understand programming as a whole. Python helps with that.

 

While this is true, and it's fairly easy to set up, you still need some amount of glue code to be able to do something useful with it in Unity, and it's not really something I'd recommend for a beginner.

 

Always good to get another opinion. So now I know it's possible but I shouldn't go down that route. I already started learning C# and I gotta say I am grasping it better than I did a couple years ago but it's still a huge pain, it's a very strict language and the format is so complex. There is SO MUCH to cover before I can even allow myself to THINK about implementing my C# knowledge in game development. I guess it's just a matter of time. Only very few people grasp it so well that within weeks they are advanced programmers who can easily develop games. Most of us need 6-12 months minimum to have the right confidence for such projects. I know my uncle who's been a computer programmer and a professor (a very good one) for years, is still learning. I guess you never finish learning a programming language...

 

You say very few, I'd say none.
Getting to an advanced level will take more than weeks, it will take years. But you will be able to make games far before that point. The best way to learn is to get stuck in.
But if you expect to be pushing a game out within the next few weeks, you may want to adjust your expectations. These things take time, but rest easy in the fact that you are learning a useful, transferable skill.

Also, enjoy the experience, there's no need for learning to be a chore, and in fact, if you really can't enjoy programming, this may not be the best choice. You could look into visual scripting as others have suggested.

 

I woud strongly recomend getting a copy of playmaker.

It's fairly cheap and it makes projects a lot more managable, especially with handling game states and player states. You'll quickly find that finite state machines get very complicated very fast and playmaker will help tremendously.

 

I second this. You can learn C# by reading what the update code does for the playmaker nodes. And you can also write your own. It's a great way to organize your code, learn how state machines work, and most important learn c#

 

It's utter crap. Do yourself a favour and use C#. They're very similar on the surface so there's no reason not to.

 

I started with Unityscript because the tutorial I was following was using it, but later switched to C# after a couple small games, because it looked better to me, and because most tutorials I was interested in were in C#. Whatever suits you best. If you understand one, youll understand the other too.

 

I think most people who push UnityScript fail to remember or don't take into account that the tutorials in Unity's Learn section were made with C#. There is a box below the video with the script in alternative language(s), but they are explained in C#.

Additionally popular video tutorials from YouTubers like Quill18 and BergZerg are C#. The Udemy course that holds the most popularity is C#. If you're going to learn through these sources, you'll need to manually translate to UnityScript.

 

Maybe someone could write an Editor Script than converts Python into C#

 

Python is as ridiculous as it can get. Better using something more professional, like Common Lisp.

 

Lua!

 

That's fine choice as well.

 

Yeah I updated the language choice when I couldn't find a Perl interpreter. Not that you couldn't rewrite the interpreter in C# and have it sit on top of Mono, but Lua already has one.

 

Lua is too mainstream. I seriously would want to use Lisp for user scripting in my game, but can't due to no released Lisp interpreter for Unity (and my lack of skill to make one).

 

I can't thank you all enough for engaging in this thread and giving me such great criticism.
I will reply to each post:

I have accomplished a number of unrealistic things in my life, maybe it was luck but I think I am just very stubborn. When I want something, I get it done. I still didn't go to bed, I am still learning. I TOTALLY agree with the "getting stuck" advice. Every time I got stuck, I understood subjects we didn't even cover yet in college, I had to research and find my way out of trouble. I love that process (as much as it looks like I don't, because I may start losing my mind but I calm down quickly) I didn't expect to publish the next big game before 2016 or anything like that. I just want to be able to bring my ideas into life and I know it may take a year or two, before I can achieve fair results and maybe even longer, probably longer for great results. I do see some aspects of programming as chores but once I truly understand something, I enjoy it. I am not voiding scripting but I got my eye on C#.

I just checked it out and I think it's a great idea. It will help me get started.

That photo made me laugh so hard. Ye I am definitely going to purchase it. I've been buying everything that's on my computer for a few years now. Ye it's a bit pricey this way but developers earned the right for it. Plus it's less of a headache when you purchase things.

You're a strict one. I agree with you that shortcuts must not be made on the way to success. I am only doing it because I want to understand this world of programming a lot better. I think every advice here has a good point. At the end of the day, C# is the way to go though, so I see what you're saying.

Do you think it helped you that you started out with Unityscript or just slowed you down? I did notice that the most useful tutorials and books out there are mostly in C#.

Lol, let's not be hostile haha... Thanks for clarifying that point. I had no idea. with every reply it seems that I need to cut my losses and just take on C#.

I think I gave up on using Python within Unity but I'd like to know the answer to your question as well.

Get to work Would be pretty cool if my thread will lead to that.

I actually saw some awesome things created with Python. I think it's an amazing language especially for kids who just started programming. It's very forgiving thus no one should get too used to it but it's a great language to understand what's it all about, at least to begin understanding. I think every language is useful. Some more than others...

Thanks for that share.

I studied Perl in high school and college. Pretty neat. It was one semester and it really takes a lot more than rushed messy 3 months of college to understand a language though.

Once again, maybe people here should unite and transform those ideas to reality haha.



So to sum up... I think I have to cut my losses and fully take on C# without wasting too much time on easier languages or easier ways to achieve my goals. Thanks a lot once again. I hope that soon I will be able to help someone who is just starting out themselves, just like you did here for me.

 

C# is super cool... future you will be glad you learned it. It is daunting to start programming, but C# isn't going to be the hard part, it's all the concepts... just soldier on, and keep a positive attitude about it.

 

Utter nonsense. It took me a day to get my first basic game completed in Unity with no prior experiance in C#. I have had previous experiance in programming in Visual Basic, but not a lot. You can follow tutorials for Roll A Ball and a ton of other stuff. You can also google for help or ask questions on the forum.

Heck, with UNet even the noob dream of building an MMO is not really an impossibility anymore.

As to the language choices, here are the major differences.

• C# is well documented documented, and has a ton of learning resources. UnityScript has close to nothing.
• C# requires you to strongly type all of your variables. UnityScript has weaker typing. This lets beginners get the hang if code without worrying about typing. But it turns around and smacks you in the face pretty quickly, and the typing errors produced by UnityScript need a fairly decent programmer to understand. (But not to fix).
• UnityScript has a lot of syntactic sugar. So the language require slightly less typing.

Most users believe that C# is better. But there are still a few ardent supporters of UnityScript. If unity had decided to continue to support and develop the language it could have become a powerful thing. But for now it's just languishing and will eventually go the way of Boo. That might still be a decade away yet, but it will come.

 

I absolutely love C#, I actually made my first game for Android in Java and used some random 3D Java engine as well. The switch from Java to C# was really easy, too. I did dabble with making a C# Windows program back in high school too, and just learned on the go then.

Honestly I feel like C# is where it's at and if you are thinking long term, just sit down and start going through some C# tutorials and it'll feel natural!

 

Code (csharp):

1. def hahahah
2.   if (pythonisforgiving == 1)
3.     print("I am a program written in Python."
4.   print("Good luck debugging me.")
5.     print("Maybe we should go out sometime?")
6.   else
7.     print("hahahahahahaha")

Anyway, when it comes to Unity, C# is best option. This is the only thing Microsoft ever did right (but only because people involved into designing Borland's Object Pascal works on C# now) and is very good and fast to write code in.

 

That's how I getcha.

Enjoy it though, it functions as well as any other. I even bought it for fun last december so I could study the way it structures code.

 

I came to Unity with just some Matlab, Python, shell scripting and R scripting experience. I had completely avoided any object oriented aspects of any languages that I had worked with. I started with C# with unity and I never thought that was a bad choice nor was it terribly difficult. So much of the learning material is in C# these days, I can't imagine going with anything else.

 

Nope, I clearly mentioned that.

Wrong. I find C# is an obnoxious backwards-syntax language and not very fun to program with. Unityscript has a better flow and is more tightly integrated with Unity; I'm measurably more productive with it. It has drawbacks, but I would not trust anyone who speaks in absolutes. If some (weird ) person prefers C# syntax, hey, whatever, peoples' brains work differently and Unity is big enough to accommodate that.

--Eric

 

Each to his own, but I migrated from Unityscript having struggled with its bent awkwardness in 3 games and had enough. C# by contrast lets me do some pretty great time saving things like generics which afaik aren't really supported well in US.

 

Ah. I must have missed it.

Weird people? We don't have any weird people here. None at all.

 

All of the tutorials and references are in UnityScript or C#. You would be a fool to even consider using any other language when you do not even know how to program.

+1 for C#

 

Regardless, I would recommend becoming familiar with multiple languages eventually. That way you're more likely to learn "programming" rather than "how to type a sequence of characters that does a specific thing in this specific case".

--Eric

 

Well, it was microsofts attempt to recreate Java, and Java has the most verbose syntax there is. Since java was my first obsession, I enjoy the C# syntax.

Then I guess it's a good thing you live in Great Britain ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

 

Ye I think I am past the contemplation point. I think the whole attempt of me trying to avoid it was silly... Kinda embarrassing. Thank you Anselmo

Hey BoredMormon, like I said, some people grasp it a lot quicker and some, even with all the latest advancements still leave the classroom or a YouTube tutorial with a terrified expression. I think it's not just intelligence but the approach people take. Thanks for making those strong points. Great comparison. I guess Unityscript is too new to rely on as much as on C#.

Thanks for the personal stories, it actually motivates me.

touché darkhog. Well written.

Ye I agree, any experience is good experience. I did decide to take a stronger approach with C# though.

It seems to be what everyone is saying and yes I did notice a few huge very unique C# tutorial sets on YouTube and bunch of great books.

Ye I recall you did. People just get a bit emotional when it comes to programming here lol. Makes sense. This is probably the most logical and intelligent collective of individuals I ever spoke to all at once.

I didn't give up on Unityscript but I think I owe C# a try, who knows... Maybe I am better than I think I am.

Thanks for that bit of information, I didn't know that.

Lol I love this community more and more with every reply I read.

Ye, makes a lot of sense when you put it this way, although there are a lot of guides... tutorials in other languages. It just does not compare with the vast variety of C# tutorials.

Yes, just like I speak 5 languages. It helps me understand the structure of languages I barely know anything of. Plus it's really cool to say "I speak 5 languages". The complexity of a couple of them is like C# meets COBOL meets machine language and a bottle of Smirnoff.

Lots of talk about JAVA. I know I shouldn't jump from one thing to another but maybe JAVA is also a good place to start.







Wow... I learned so much here. Why didn't I visit this community earlier? I was on a few other reputable forums which were... Ok but this... This is where people really engage in a discussion as it should be.

 

You scare me.

 

Java is pretty sweet, but in my unprofessional view, it's basically C#'s brother, you can almost go back and forth. Which means it would be crazy to learn Java, just so that you can learn C# for Unity, when you can just start with C#.

Seriously, I think C# is honestly DEAD SIMPLE for programming basic things for a game. I'm sure there's a lot better ways to do things and more "professional" ways than how I program, but it's really really easy to make anything work in Unity with C#.

You can literally Google anything and almost have the code thrown at you as well. You could probably search for "Unity3D c# submarine control physics" and find 90% of the code in examples and just tweak it for your game, haha.

 

Ye I think I am sold on it. I will have 1 C# please.

 

Safaribooksonline.com has some really good C# and Unity books. Many libraries have a subscription so you might have free access. Plurasight is super awesome for C# tutorials and also has Unity tutorials.

 

Thank you!!!

 

I released two commercial games written in UnityScript, one of them very successful and still doing quite well today, five years later. UnityScript is perfectly capable. I eventually switched over to C#. It took a little time to learn but the concepts are similar to any language so I picked it up fairly easily. I used CSharpatron (highly recommended- read my glowing review on the store page, haha!) to convert some of the code from my older games to use in my latest game, got it all running fine, and now I code exclusively in C#.

Keep in mind that I started using Unity in 2009 when UnityScript was being heavily pushed and updated. Nowadays things seem to be geared much more to C#.

Nothing wrong with UnityScript at all. Aside from the fact that most tutorials, etc. assume you are using C#, you should be fine if you're more comfortable with using UnityScript to get started. You'll probably eventually want to move to C# so if you're inclined to give that a go first then hell yeah do that. Otherwise, UnityScript is perfectly fine.

 

I had to use Python back in 2000 for a flight sim we were helping develop. Erk.

 

That's why I bought it. You can view the source code for each visual scripting node - and they're in c#! Then you can extend them or write your own. It's a fun way to organize a project with tiny reusable bits of code. I might use it again in the future

If you think so then that's even more reason to try c#, since they're so similar. They even both run on virtual machines! Java on the JVM and C# on Mono. Though if you want to learn coding styles then maybe start with Java because the tutorials are pretty consistent in enforcing OOP and there's more tutorials available than anyone could follow in a lifetime.

We all fear the power wielded by the mods.

@Ony looks like this thread is settled.

First javascript, then c#, then python... this conversation better not get to ruby or else it'll really go off the rails.

( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

 

Late to the party as usual. I brought beer, though, so...

Not even gonna go there.

 

Wow thanks for this great reply! Can you link me to the games you developed? I checked out your review as well, good job! I keep hearing many people recommend Unityscript but eventually everyone gives in to C#. I think I will canvas everything but C# will be my primary goal.

What was the reason you had to use Python over another language for that project?

Ye I am definitely going to purchase it tonight. There's a huge discount going on now too.

I think I found a second home here. Best people on the internet.

 

The C# Yellow Book is a popular ebook and it's free as well. It's strictly for C# though and doesn't cover Unity.

http://www.robmiles.com/c-yellow-book/

 

Thank you. Already reading it

 

I have to second this. I wrote the ecosystem and fauna AI in UnityScript for Age Of Survival in 2.5 weeks for herds, flocks, schools, land and sea solitary prey and predators, special lurk and pounce predators like crocs... with a custom culling system. Over 60 types of animals in all so far. It will get more advanced as I continue in the next couple of weeks after the Early Access release. The AI sim with a several hundred animals was running at 150 to 200 fps and did it's thing just like on NatGeo films. I can program in C# but when I make a syntax error there is no way the compiler will point at the line in error like .us does. I use Unitron and am on OSX so VS is not an option and I won't run a VM whilst working so please don't point out the obvious to me..I don't care. I have to go back line by line from the supposed error line and suss all and every line of code.. What a time sinker. I could just write it in .us and be done with it literally seconds later, error in typing or not. I work by the hour against my original estimates so every minute counts as to whether I either make or break my per hour pay on fixed price contracts. I could care if C# is used in other industries..If I had to do corporate coding for a living I would put a bullet between my eyes. I have fun coding in Unity with .us ..even for crap projects freelancers have to do to pay the bills. Some of the C# crap of crypto codebases and frameworks and lines of code I have seen in my day are definitely scary sh*t. Like they monkey wrenched the C# class structure sidewise into Unity's component based architecture with a Komatsu earth mover.