Search Unity

  1. Calling all beginners! Join the FPS Beginners Mods Challenge until December 13.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. It's Cyber Week at the Asset Store!
    Dismiss Notice

Honey Hex framework

Discussion in 'Assets and Asset Store' started by MuHaGames_Avee, Aug 28, 2014.

?

If the hex framework was available on the Asset Store...

  1. I would not be interested in buying it - it's not good enough

    2.0%
  2. I would not be interested in buying it - I wouldn't use it

    2.0%
  3. It's interesting but needs more features (please write details below)

    9.8%
  4. I'd pay for it no more than $20

    25.5%
  5. I'd pay for it no more than $50

    35.3%
  6. I'd pay for it no more than $100

    17.6%
  7. I'd pay more than $100

    7.8%
  1. Lennartos

    Lennartos

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2013
    Posts:
    34
    Some minor updates
    Spelling error & added ClearAll + Touch functions
     

    Attached Files:

  2. leegod

    leegod

    Joined:
    May 5, 2010
    Posts:
    1,825
    Just load default WIP scene, built it.
     
  3. Lennartos

    Lennartos

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2013
    Posts:
    34
    Leegod, what is the max texture size of note 1?
    Honey2 uses a 2K texture as texture atlas - maybe that fails?
     
  4. Lennartos

    Lennartos

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2013
    Posts:
    34
    Fixed minor bug in HexGraph that would result in out of memory error on larger maps, and waste lots of resources on smaller maps:

    From line 48: added "connectionCosts.Clear();" in the loop.
    result:
    foreach (PointNode pn in nodes)
    {
    connections.Clear();
    connectionCosts.Clear();
    foreach (Vector3i v in HexNeighbors.neighbours)
     
  5. leegod

    leegod

    Joined:
    May 5, 2010
    Posts:
    1,825
    I don't know. How can I know it? Max texture size of note1?
     
  6. Lennartos

    Lennartos

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2013
    Posts:
    34
    Either google for that info, or try to make the textures smaller and see what happens
    I have supplied the resized textures for you - overwrite the ones inside Assets/HoneyFramework2WIP/Terrain and see if that helps
     

    Attached Files:

  7. Lennartos

    Lennartos

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2013
    Posts:
    34
  8. Lennartos

    Lennartos

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2013
    Posts:
    34
    Kash
    I have looked at the shader and its pretty much as simple as can be - nothing fancy there.
    The performance seems to suffer from the HEX coordinate system conversions and not the "work" itself.
    Im not strong enough in the hex math to see any better method to reduce direct instructions. ( what i found on google was similar as you used here ), and dividing the work up into seperate render passes again imposes unity PRO version... So i think we just have to accept it as it is.

    On the good side, after i fixed the HexGrid - i had a 300K hex grid visible with 3ms render time.
    We should have switched LOD long before that, so i dont think that the shader performance really is a issue.

    Edit:
    Could one use the vetexes as a data as a container for hex data?
    For example If the mesh would follow hex design, then a simple methods like UV can be used to tell distance from center and which axis is more powerful - no hard math needed.
     
    Last edited: Dec 12, 2014
  9. fizy45

    fizy45

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2014
    Posts:
    5
    Instead of creating random worlds,do we have ability to create maps on our own ?

    It will be really awesome if I can use this asset to create maps of the certain locations then build a strategy game on top of that.

    If the answer is yes I will surely buy it.
     
  10. leegod

    leegod

    Joined:
    May 5, 2010
    Posts:
    1,825
    WIP strange. Its build for android even take 10 minutes loading time at note1.
     
  11. Khash-Firestorm

    Khash-Firestorm

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2013
    Posts:
    86
    "WIP strange. Its build for android even take 10 minutes loading time at note1."
    I do not understand this sentence

    Fizy45: We do not provide World editor, but you are free to define your own world via code. It require at least basic coding skills. Internet is full of the techniques to build procedural world data to make it have any sense, or you could write data to some xml format and use those data instead or simple "random" used at the moment.

    This is Framework, not a base for the game, so it work providing you with the tools to calculate hexes, and display them, blend etc. But whole game related details like "how your world should looks like" is still in your hand. You can replace textures provided by us to keep your chosen style and provide world definition to make it sense in universe you have chosen. Framework is providing you with technological solutions which are sometimes above of your skills or simply it would take to much time to reinvent the wheel if you can have it for few $ :)
    You get full source code of the framework (so nothing is hidden from you) and you can and should adjust all bits of it to your needs and your vision. But again: it would require at least basic programming skills. The better your skills the more you can customize :)
     
  12. fizy45

    fizy45

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2014
    Posts:
    5
    The water-terrain blend and overall layout of the map looks fantastic and its really sad that we cannot edit worlds within the unity editor and add 3d objects on top of it.(cities,units etc)

    Still very nice piece of work.But untill it doesnt support editing via editor I think its missing a huge profit opportunity.As you can notice your asset provides best hex-based solution with working 3d enviroment.Shame that it cannot be edited in 3d enviroment.

    Think about the other assets and complete projects out there,many developers build their games via scripting and unity editor so missing that part is not a good thing.In further updates you guys should really consider about giving us some editor support maybe not map painting but we definetly should be able to use the full force of the unity editing tools.

    I would definetly pay +100$ for an asset like that.
     
  13. overthere

    overthere

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2013
    Posts:
    101
    Obviously its your asset to develop as you will but I just thought I'd echo fizy45's comments, you have a great opportunity to fill a gap in the asset store for a high quality 'friendlier' hex system, and one you would be able to charge a premium for, anyway asset looks great really high quality blending will keep an eye on how it develops. Good luck with the game you are making.
     
  14. Khash-Firestorm

    Khash-Firestorm

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2013
    Posts:
    86
    Thanks guys! I plan to improve Honey over next few patches but plan for the editor is not yet in the schedule and would not be for sure before we finish game.
    I'm the only coder in our team and this produces heavy constrains especially that our family still need to pay for life (MuHa Games is a family business with only us four and funds from single pocket)

    Honey was a result of our game development and our will to share this technology with other developers. It neither produce income nor cover cost of the time invested in support for the Honey and I doubt editor will change this radically. To survive we need to make games which can produce income and this way allow Honey to evolve along and with the funds we get from them.

    We have few very interesting ideas in Honey under development which will enrich this framework but they would not make it point&click simple. We aim at the moment to push its boundaries, make it an amassing technology, and I believe that games witch would use it would make us proud of our fellow developers.
    At some point when we will work on making editor it would be again more as an example "how to" and a base for one, but it would never be deep game specific feature.

    On the other hand if someone is willing to make an editor for Honey give us a shout, and then we can help you understand bits if needed here or there or adjust some bits to ensure stability and quality of your plugin. You will not be able to resale Honey of course, but you can sale addon for Honey, and if quality will be acceptable we will advertise you on our networks :)
     
  15. fizy45

    fizy45

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2014
    Posts:
    5
    Still consider it,or search the internet there are thousands of people who are actually looking for a decent strategy platform to build their games on with unity and without unity there is none good avalible so you wont be just filling the empty spots in unity market you will reply the huge demand for amateur developers around.There are hundreads of assets in asset store and yours are shown at top of the page even with its current state (featured,most popular) why? Because people desperetly need some decent looking easy to use strategy platform.

    One day somebody will fill this gap,you already managed to create a gorgeous 3d looking enviroment so far the best looking strategy asset in asset store but yet its missing important points and those has to be filled.Belive it or not this asset with editor support will earn you more money than actual game.(Its not just me saying this even some folks asset comment section demands it too.

    Making a project to sell somebody is a good idea.

    Making a project which has huge unanswered demand is a better idea.

    Also do you use predefined maps in your game or all of your game maps consists random created worlds ?
     
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2014
  16. Khash-Firestorm

    Khash-Firestorm

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2013
    Posts:
    86
    Our game is using world generated procedurarly so no editor required.
    As for the filling demand gap its always a good way to earn some extra cash, but not all demand filling gap brings enough to cover costs to do so. We will do our best to support developers in their work for great strategy games but I love making games, That is what I do first and foremost and that's how I produce income for my family cause I'm good at it :)

    I'm grateful for the input but neither promisses of the income nor other reasons can make me to change my mind / repriorityze it. We do games... home made, best baked games :) and as far as I know our games produce more income than NGUI, which sales as one of the top-best assets on asset store with which we cannot compete with honey even having editor (all games have UI, few games are strategy hex games which can benefit from Honey...)

    Next year 3 titles we were/are involved in development would get released:
    Thea: The Awakening (MuHa Games)
    The Witcher 3: The Wild Hunt (CDPR)
    Project Cars (Slightly Mad Studios)

    And believe me making them and seeing all those players which will have fun with our "children" makes me wake up every day, makes me work 7 days a week for many more hours than I should :p and I hope we will be able to spread this passion via our works like Honey to other talented developers ensuring that when we do not make games we have other great games to play (yes so selfish ;D )
     
  17. leegod

    leegod

    Joined:
    May 5, 2010
    Posts:
    1,825
    @fizy45 I totally agree.
    @khash So you are also involved in Witcher3 and Project Cars? Outsourcing? as programmer?
     
  18. fizy45

    fizy45

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2014
    Posts:
    5
    Anyway lets return back to the subejct !

    Is it hard to code the main aspects of the map so we can create prefefined maps also what about 3d objects their placement on maps and units,their interecations etc surely there must be a way to implement them.
     
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2014
  19. Khash-Firestorm

    Khash-Firestorm

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2013
    Posts:
    86
    @fizy45 You can place 3d objects on maps (look for actor class which do this. I use it in our game and it works well :) )
    What interactions do you think of? Honey have code to move units around the world, have pathfinder powered by A* project, do you think there should be more for units on map? Fight or whatever is very project specific.

    As for editor: You have an ability to Save, Load and change map at runtime. I would not name it an editor as it does not have any display tools but its a base for designing your own map if you do not want to use procedural worlds. I have seen some of our customers using this system to load simplified real world map. Processing map color to terrain type and then loading it as a world in honey. Developed in 1 day, so I can assume that if you wish to have your world designed by designers you should be able to provide them some tools building on top of the honey. If you have problems at some stage I will try to help you via forum :)

    @leegod We were involved in W3 earlier this year as outsource, we took part in development of the W2 as well ;) We currently work on Project Cars and Thea of course :D do not forget Thea
     
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2014
  20. leegod

    leegod

    Joined:
    May 5, 2010
    Posts:
    1,825
    How large size map honey can make for mobile target? 50 * 50 or 100 * 100 or 200 * 200 tile's map possible?
     
  21. fizy45

    fizy45

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2014
    Posts:
    5
    Change the map in runtime ? How was that possible,you change the code and see the results ?

    Let me ask you with an example.

    Check these map below(I just found it in google) I dont want to create something looks real,I want to create representation of some areas from the world.

    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/78/Henderson_Island_Map.jpg

    or

    http://www.lib.utexas.edu/maps/us_2001/hawaii_ref_2001.jpg

    or

    http://imagizer-cv.imageshack.us/a/img839/6863/v9q5.jpg (a map represents Arabian peninsula and India not accruate but gives the impression)

    Assume that I want to make a map like those (sea,beaches,small mountains and forest) and I dont want to use real world data is it possible to do it with your asset ? Is using the real world data the only way to create a specific map ?

    If its possible to create a map which gives an impresson of beign in those areas I want to learn how can I do it ?
     
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2014
  22. Khash-Firestorm

    Khash-Firestorm

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2013
    Posts:
    86
    @leegod 50x50 is about 2500 hexes. ( I assume we talk about the current version not the one which is under development) I would assume that 50x50 is big for mobiles, but I didnt done those tests on mobiles. Civilization5 biggest map was something like 120x80 which is something around 9600 hexes. I would not count with current system that mobiles will have memory for this scale of the world even with low resolution.

    @fizy45
    "Change the map in runtime ?"
    yes we have an example where you can change mat hex by clicking on it to another random type. Its up to your code what type it would be after click, you can add some menu where you choose the terrain type first and then click on map to apply or something. But all you have at the moment is basic system, if you want to have editor you will need to build one that suits you.

    As for representation of the world, this is exactly the case other client were achieving with his own code.
    - You have a world texture,
    - convert texture coordinates to hex world.
    - Sample texture at those coordinates and convert result color to terrain type which it should represent
    - add this terrain type at those coordinates.

    You should remember that in hex world X, Y and Z are not in 90 degrees between themselves but rather 120 degrees. You should take this into an account then converting data between texture and world. Calculation classes in honey should come handy for those purposes. But I would assume you will need to have at least average programming skills (Designer only will not be able to do this alone, but coder can prepare data loading which then can be passed to designer which will load number or maps.
     
  23. etoreo

    etoreo

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2012
    Posts:
    104
    I have a few questions before I buy this asset...
    1) Can I remove individual trees from a title? I plan to build roads through tiles and will need to remove specific trees if the road collides with them.
    2) Do trees get saved/loaded with the terrain or do they end up randomly generated on load? If they are saved and loaded, will it be compatible with removing a tree? Put another way: can I remove a tree, save the terrain, reload the train and see the exact state as I left it?
    3) Is there a way to query the terrain/titles about where a river is (what sides of a hex tile they are "on")? I will need to build bridges over them AND work that into the cost structure of my path finding.

    Thank you for your time. This looks like an amazing asset.
     
  24. Khash-Firestorm

    Khash-Firestorm

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2013
    Posts:
    86
    Hi!

    1. Yes, you can find correct tree by asking hex owner. remove it and then do terrain rebuild. It will rebuild foreground mesh as well.
    2. Trees are saved together with terrain, yes. So you can even do a seasons update for trees (green tree at summer and naked branches at winter) by updating tree type instead of position. You want to do this update with some loading screen though because it takes noticable amount of time (eg 0.2s, based on the device speed ) and mesh is destroyed for update process.
    3. there is no data about rivers in hexes, which would have to be at some point. For now you have postprocessed river data in the world class directly. You may want to use preprocessed river data which is simply corners between 3 hexes.
    Having this data you will want to go through the river nodes and check pairs of nodes (current and next) two hexes would be identical for both corners and one would be different. Those identical hexes are those separated by the river.
    It is something what would endup in the code earlier or later but for now you will need to write yourself.
     
  25. MuHaGames_Avee

    MuHaGames_Avee

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2013
    Posts:
    25
    NEW FORUM!
    Because this thread is getting longer and it's hard to find specific information without reading the entire thread,
    we've created a dedicated forum for Honey users and invite you to discuss everything there.
    Head over to: http://honey.boards.net/
     
  26. chrisk

    chrisk

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2009
    Posts:
    555
    Hi, Guys,
    I just found this tool and I've been looking for a usealbe hex editor for a long time.
    I found a open source hex editor and game called Battle of Wesnoth.
    www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tKaV5yK4Vk
    Please check it out. It's very powerful and interesting tool, and full source code is available.
    I really wish Honey Hex Framework will support Map Editor.
    Thanks.

    -ck
     
  27. Khash-Firestorm

    Khash-Firestorm

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2013
    Posts:
    86
    I have plan to make a hotfix over holidays to provide some fixes including some provided by community (thanks @Lennartos )
     
  28. Khash-Firestorm

    Khash-Firestorm

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2013
    Posts:
    86
  29. tango209

    tango209

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2011
    Posts:
    378
    Kash was kind enough to let me post here to let you all know that I'm working on a map editor for their excellent framework. You can find the WIP thread here. Any feedback would be welcomed.
     
  30. MuHaGames_Avee

    MuHaGames_Avee

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2013
    Posts:
    25
    Wow Tango, this looks awesome! Great job!
    At the moment we're working on a gameplay video for Thea: The Awakening, but once it's done, Khash said he'd try to improve the tile replacing mechanism so it doesn't show the entire chunk being generated.

    If anyone would like to discuss, head over to http://honey.boards.net/ - our dedicated support forum.
     
    tango209 likes this.
  31. FisherM

    FisherM

    Unity Technologies

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2013
    Posts:
    366
    okay three questions
    1) How large can worlds be? can I have it load it in chunk as needed?
    2) If I have an AI controller controlling all ai on map can it load a data version so the AI controller can have the whole map loaded
    3) Does the movement have to be locked from grid to grid?
     
  32. Khash-Firestorm

    Khash-Firestorm

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2013
    Posts:
    86
    Hi FisherM!

    1) World size is limited by memory you want to use for it. It get around 2GB of ram for high resolution world of about 6000 hexes. Its wise to keep your world below 5000 for normal game although we have tested it with many more (eg over 8000 hexes is on the screenshot on the store) it have almost none performance drop for big maps exluding allocated memory. You may lower texture quality if you like to play with higher size worlds.

    Dynamic loading is not implemented itself but you can update world map using features in honey and load/save from drive so you are free to put it together for much bigger worlds than we use. (We actually build game on Honey http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/430305481, and we buidl our game features on top on those available to everyone in honey, so you can be sure that we do our best to ensure this framework is great :D for the best of everyone! )

    2) We do not implement AI, we have plugged only pathfinder library and tested to it ensure it works. Feel free to consult A* library page for thwat you can ahieve with it: http://arongranberg.com/astar/

    3) No, it doesnt have to be locked. I have seen some of our clients which were using hex map as a "regions" and played normal RTS game on it. In our demo you can see actors which make formation which is simply one character navigating from hex to hex and other finding their place relative to it, but its just one of almost unlimited number of other possibilities to use floating point world.
     
  33. FisherM

    FisherM

    Unity Technologies

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2013
    Posts:
    366
    If I wanted to manually design a continent with different biomes what would I have to do?
    Can it do cliffs and elevated lands?
     
  34. Khash-Firestorm

    Khash-Firestorm

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2013
    Posts:
    86
    We do not have an editor for the terrain, but there is nothing stopping you from changing hexes to required type and using some elevation, although texturing is done topdown so some 3d models (eg stones etc) may be needed to get really good quality in strong vertical areas.
    Look at http://forum.unity3d.com/threads/map-editor-for-the-honey-hex-framework.294244/ where one of our customesrs build his own editor for Honey
     
  35. overthere

    overthere

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2013
    Posts:
    101
    Do you have a feel on when you'll be able to fix the issue in Honey that's stopping him releasing the editor?
    Ta
     
  36. Khash-Firestorm

    Khash-Firestorm

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2013
    Posts:
    86
    this one which is related to the rebuild? (thsts the only one I know of) Its rebuild order issue, quality of the rebuild have been updated with Honey 1.5
     
  37. overthere

    overthere

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2013
    Posts:
    101
    Could be, I was referring to this comment @tango209 made:
    There's an issue in they Honey Hex Framework when rebuilding along the seems that needs to be fixed, then I'll be publishing the asset. I've pinged them on the issue again and hope to hear something soon.
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2015
  38. FisherM

    FisherM

    Unity Technologies

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2013
    Posts:
    366
    Are you limited to having the mini style mountains or would it be possible to have very tall mountains?
     
  39. tango209

    tango209

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2011
    Posts:
    378
    The issue was fixed last month, but I was out of town for a couple weeks. The asset has been submitted and if it passes muster, it should be up soon.
     
    overthere likes this.
  40. Khash-Firestorm

    Khash-Firestorm

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2013
    Posts:
    86
    Perfect timing @tango209! Good luck on store!

    @FisherM textures are mapped top down so if you sterach to much it would lose quality, which if you really need such a thing you can cover in the world shader and use another texture on very vertical surfaces by blending betwen normal and vertical colors :)
     
  41. Khash-Firestorm

    Khash-Firestorm

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2013
    Posts:
    86
    ps Please move further conversations if possible to our forum: http://honey.boards.net/
    because it would give better visibility for other users :)
     
  42. Khash-Firestorm

    Khash-Firestorm

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2013
    Posts:
    86
    Edit: Note that person which this conversation was with have left forum and removed its own posts

    There is no switch to do so, but its fairly easy to remove this code from world oven which bakes the texture
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2015
  43. Khash-Firestorm

    Khash-Firestorm

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2013
    Posts:
    86
    Edit: Note that person which this conversation was with have left forum and removed its own posts

    Hi!
    We were not able to reproduce your save issue.
    As for "it just generates land and that's it" says that you are very young developer who had no idea what is buying. Our framework is a system which generates, blends and bakes land using hexagonal coordinate system. Prepares foreground, rivers and water bodies and offers advanced libraries for math around those features. Its not a "game with source code" so yes if you just press play it will produce some random world. It is expected that you will extend it to the game. This plugin is just a tool to make it much easier, for many developers its not even something they can't achieve themselves but it still saves their time.
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2015
    overthere and FisherM like this.
  44. FisherM

    FisherM

    Unity Technologies

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2013
    Posts:
    366

    Well it works nicely for me, I'd love to get some help paging terrains in and having an editor of sorts released. But yeah, young developer or not you're complaining about "it not working" when numerous people have no problem.
     
  45. Helli_liange

    Helli_liange

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2017
    Posts:
    5
    I changed the way of generating the maps, all first calculate the hex, then calculate the amount of need to generate chuck, then determine which hex inside the rectangle, then load the back, but my each rectangle and the place for a rectangular border have crack, can you tell me what reason be?
     
  46. Helli_liange

    Helli_liange

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2017
    Posts:
    5
    upload_2017-2-27_23-9-44.png

    I changed the way of generating the maps, all first calculate the hex, then calculate the amount of need to generate chuck, then determine which hex inside the rectangle, then load the back, but my each rectangle and the place for a rectangular border have crack, can you tell me what reason be?
     
  47. MuHaGames_Avee

    MuHaGames_Avee

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2013
    Posts:
    25
    Well, from the screen I can see that chunks do not stitch properly. Sorry to say but I'm unable to support custom changes to the framework. But a couple things you could check - does your rectangle take into account the mixing area of the hex texture? Remember to include rotated texture reach (when you rotate a texture by say 45 degrees, it's dimensions will change).
     
  48. Helli_liange

    Helli_liange

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2017
    Posts:
    5
    Thank you very much, but I still didn't solve my problem, I upload my project,but too large, if possible,please give me you email , could you help me to look at, where the problem, really very thank you.
     
  49. Helli_liange

    Helli_liange

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2017
    Posts:
    5
    you can give me your facebook ,if possible,thanks
     
  50. MuHaGames_Avee

    MuHaGames_Avee

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2013
    Posts:
    25
    I'm very sorry, but I really won't be able to help more as I know very little about programming (Honey was written by another person).