Search Unity

  1. Megacity Metro Demo now available. Download now.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. Unity support for visionOS is now available. Learn more in our blog post.
    Dismiss Notice

can i make and sell toys based off characters from the store? - legal or illegal

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by r2dj, Jan 17, 2018.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. r2dj

    r2dj

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2018
    Posts:
    8
    are there limits to how we can profit from assets? we can if it's in our games but can we also make merchandise like toys, shirts, mugs etc. based off the characters we purchased? is there someone that's actively doing it now? thanks again for taking the time.

    -rj
     
  2. LaneFox

    LaneFox

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2011
    Posts:
    7,462
    You can be sued for anything.

    Not a lawyer.
     
  3. TonyLi

    TonyLi

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2012
    Posts:
    12,670
    I'm not a lawyer either, but the Asset Store Terms are pretty clear:

    (Section 2.2. Emphasis mine.)

    But nothing's stopping you from contacting the artist directly and asking for permission to use their work in other forms, too.
     
    wccrawford, Kiwasi, derf and 2 others like this.
  4. r2dj

    r2dj

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2018
    Posts:
    8
    i knew it wouldn't be that simple...damn...and thanks!
     
  5. neginfinity

    neginfinity

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2013
    Posts:
    13,554
    It is forbidden. You are not allowed to sell derived works based on assets you bought, and you are only allowed to use them in interactive media.
    Asset store eula section 3.8
     
    Kiwasi likes this.
  6. ThermodynamicsMakesMeHot

    ThermodynamicsMakesMeHot

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2015
    Posts:
    224
    Licensor grants to the END-USER a non-exclusive, worldwide, and perpetual license to the Asset to integrate Assets only as incorporated and embedded components of electronic games and interactive media and distribute such electronic game and interactive media.

    So basically if you than make Videos or screenshots your also breaking the ToS? Since your now creating derived works based on the assets. So if you post to youtube and ads monetize or screen shots turned into posters.

    So basically the impression I get its best to never use any art/model assets from the store because you can use them in game only and never allowed to do anything else with them. But I have never heard of anything like this not to say it wouldn't happen.

    Consider this definition:

    Any form of interface between the end user/audience and the medium may be considered interactive. Interactive media is not limited to electronic media or digital media. Board games, pop-up books, gamebooks, flip books and constellation wheels are all examples of printer interactive media. Books with a simple table of contents or index may be considered interactive due to the non-linear control mechanism in the medium, but are usually considered non-interactive since the majority of the user experience is non-interactive reading


    Say for example: as long as you add a barcode that can be read from a t-shirt it is now interactive media by definition.
    Or you release a soundtrack that plays videos or interacts with the user as a table of contents. It would seem you can circumvent this quite easily but from reading judges hate it when you loop hole the law but not sure about contractual wordings.

    Look at the company who is called Steve Jobs Clothing. Apple tried suing them over it and lost. Not quite the same as an asset from the store but it allows a look into how you can and are allowed to profit of others work legally.

    I am not a lawyer but it would seem you can do whatever you want and wait and see approach if you get sued and fight it unless there has been precedence set somewhere else already. It would be basically be argued and a judge would essential decide yes or no.

    So than it begs the question "it even worth it to use the asset store for art or music?"
     
  7. r2dj

    r2dj

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2018
    Posts:
    8
    good points and I agree it can have loop holes but I went ahead and emailed the asset creators asking if they'd let me use them for videos instead of games. i'd rather avoid trouble as much as possible. thanks tho!
     
  8. TonyLi

    TonyLi

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2012
    Posts:
    12,670
    While the EULA could have been written better, I think we all know its intent, and that showing videos of your game is allowed. You can always ask Unity if you have a specific question. I wouldn't get worked up over using Asset Store art in ways that seem reasonable like this. It's what the store is there for.
     
  9. ThermodynamicsMakesMeHot

    ThermodynamicsMakesMeHot

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2015
    Posts:
    224
    I like to think that as well however the way its worded give the impression that you could in theory lose all your hardwork being sued. It only takes one person to push this and then a precedence is set. I read about people losing their videos due to copyright take downs using music or graphics in their videos from asset packages they have purchased. So it's not like it doesn't happen and the EULA here isn't going to help defend if that happens.

    It's a scary thought that "It could" happen and there is nothing you can do about it. It's a roll of the dice.

    The other side is your limited by what you can do so it's probally not a good choice to use any assets because what if you hit it big you now cant market posters or images, comics, wallpapers etc of your game because you don't actually own the content..your just renting it basically to use but you cant really do much with it.

    So to me this really feels like there is no good purpose to use the asset store unless its for prototyping. Using the store for a successful dev is a losing battle and loss of revenue. Why would anyone want that?
     
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2018
  10. TonyLi

    TonyLi

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2012
    Posts:
    12,670
    Right, so if someone's concerned about that, they can ask Unity to clarify. No need to roll the dice.
     
  11. neginfinity

    neginfinity

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2013
    Posts:
    13,554
    You sound upset for some reason.

    If you want a proper answer, ask a lawyer.

    There were precedents where people were sued for copyright infringement because they made a sculpture based on a photograph.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rogers_v._Koons

    In general, however, in case of unity store using screenshots and videos is okay, BUT making 3d prints of chracters and using art for t-shirts will be definitely not okay. If you want this kind of use, you'll need to use a different store with wider range of permissions or more permissive licenses. Unity is not a stock photo site and is not a 3d model exchange site.
     
    Kiwasi likes this.
  12. neginfinity

    neginfinity

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2013
    Posts:
    13,554
    The store is designed to sell materials for making games and interactive media only.

    You don't get broadcasting license, and you don't get "derivative works" rights. For advanced use (t-shirts and broadcasting) you may need to use a different store.
     
    theANMATOR2b and Kiwasi like this.
  13. ThermodynamicsMakesMeHot

    ThermodynamicsMakesMeHot

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2015
    Posts:
    224
    You sound like a TROLL for some reason. A basic questions causes you too get all defensive. Whats your deal?

    Plus you don't even know what your talking about. I am not the OP. I am just making points. Why are you trying to start a fight?.. If you have nothing to offer constructively you should keep quiet as nothing you said pertains to me at all.

    Unlike you, I am not trying to argue, just adding my points to the OP.
    I am just talking here. Anyone planning to make a successful game should really think twice about the asset store due to legalities.
     
  14. ThermodynamicsMakesMeHot

    ThermodynamicsMakesMeHot

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2015
    Posts:
    224
    Here you go again trying to start a fight. Its a basic question that anyone should ask themselves. I never said anyone gets any sort of rights or anything. I only pointed out that people should think about the future of their game and IP and not think of the store as way to propel them but also consider it as a crutch because you don't own your IP. At the end of the day it's own by someone else.

    So I think it's a very fair question to ask why should we use the asset store.

    If anyone else is not going to be constructive and just wants to fight save yourself the time and move on.
     
  15. ThermodynamicsMakesMeHot

    ThermodynamicsMakesMeHot

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2015
    Posts:
    224
    That's where I wonder about the Dev. If you reach out to them and they said sure go ahead and use that for whatever, would you then need to have that Dev give you access to the asset through a different channel? I don't think anyone can override the ToS even if your the Dev. So essentialyl even with permission since you got the asset from the store you would be bound to that ToS and not the dev, since that was the source of said asset. Since your allowed to sell your asset elsewhere does that mean you can apply your own ToS to your asset? Any devs have input?

    I doubt that anytime in the future anyones game will be so successful to be made into a movie but what if. I admit I never looked that closely at the usage of the assets but If I were using art or assets I would definatly want to resue them in every possible format to maximize revenues and exposures. Mainly pertaining to kickstarter when you offer posters or tshirts for certain funding levels so in light of that it really brings into question should you use art and music from the store for anything other than a small game or prototyping.

    For the record I do not use art or music from the store because of this reason, I have no emotional attachment to the issue but a logic standpoint it seems like a no brainer to not use that stuff at all.

    If no one really cares about this then theres no vehicle for change but if enough people speak up than changes could be made. I wonder if there are others who do not use the store for this reason.
     
  16. JohnnyA

    JohnnyA

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2010
    Posts:
    5,041
    I can't imagine such a claim getting anywhere near an actual court but if it did creating videos and screenshots of your game will almost certainly fall under fair-use.

    Fair-use is generally quite flexible in the way they allow judges to make common sense decisions, you only need to get by on one of the provisions and the judge can add other provisions as they see fit. This use is transformative, and has no effect on the works value.

    Remember you can also be sued for doing something completely legal, and you can also be hit by a car as you cross a street.

    - - -

    EDIT: Also keep in mind the typical outcome of such a case is that you have to remove the copyright work (in this case from your screen shots and videos); its hard to imagine damages either punitive or compensatory being awarded.

    The publicity of the case would likely be better marketing than the videos anyway!

    - - -

    EDIT: Also there is a very simple solution. Just ask the asset store author for permission to use their asset in your promotional material. I wouldn't expect any of them to say no. If they do then worse case you have to go and replace their asset, if its not vital just don't put in in your videos,
     
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2018
  17. JohnnyA

    JohnnyA

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2010
    Posts:
    5,041
    BTW Much more likely is someone putting something on the store with they don't own. Unity's vetting process can only go so far (and its pretty weak).

    If your game made a bit of money the legitimate owner could go after you instead of the publisher. Then you try to chase-up the publisher, who has disappeared, so then you have to set sights on UT for failing to vet the publisher properly ...

    ... I choose not to live my life in fear :)
     
    angrypenguin likes this.
  18. ThermodynamicsMakesMeHot

    ThermodynamicsMakesMeHot

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2015
    Posts:
    224
    I know right, so this whole thing is sorta like a rabbit hole of what if's and could be's. I don't think there can ever be a solid answer as I am sure every point of view could be argued either way and all make sense in some perspective.

    I heard more then once people getting caught using copyrighted materials from assets they purchased on the store that slipped by. In one instance, the company went directly after the publisher and skipped Unity entirely, publicly at least.

    It is a sad fact that people can sue you for everything. I read an article about a musician putting up a video of white noise he created getting told 4 or 5 others claimed copyright on his youtube video, and lately there are so many crazy stories popping up everywhere about this kind of stuff. Even Peter, the creative talent behind "The Last Unicorn" is getting his stuff stolen away and its all getting lost in litigation. That there shows how you can be sued even when your the legal owner of said IP. The cost of all that is the real scare factor.

    With regards to permission from the Dev/Author who created it...Can they give you usage rights to the asset over and above what already was agreed to when you downloaded it from the asset store or would you need to obtain said assets elsewhere? I highly doubt unity would go after someone or something for doing this but when lots of money is involved people always want a self entitled share of that. Money makes people do horrible things.

    So i think its fair to say that these questions/scenarios would apply to any digital product and this is not confined to the Unity Asset store but every digital store or free site. Even if you create it, someone could say its copied and sue you. Happens in music all the time.
     
  19. hippocoder

    hippocoder

    Digital Ape

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2010
    Posts:
    29,723
    Get professional legal advice. Locked.
     
    schmosef, resequenced, TonyLi and 4 others like this.
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.