Asset Store Issue : Tampering with reviews "Helpful" votes

@manutoo: So you bought the asset knowing it didn't have normal or specular maps:

"I bought your assets knowing they didn't have any, but that doesn't stop me to regret there's none."​

And then you complain about that in the review? That is bullshit (not to mention your sentence doesn't even make sense). I defended your review based on a) you not knowing that it lacked normal and specular maps, and b) that it could be a valid expectation. Now I see you were full of S*** and knew about it before hand and just wanted the author to "fix" the package to your liking (which he did, and you still complain).

I am fully supporting S4G4N now. It is great he added the bit in the description about not including normal a specular maps so future customers don't have to wonder, but OP is definitely in the wrong here.

 

dbryson,
Re-read my review ; it doesn't in any way imply I didn't know the pack didn't have these maps. And I don't complain, I'm only regretting their absence, noting it'd add to the quality of the pack.
Your a) would have been my bad. Before buying, I'd have been supposed to check if the pack had these maps. So you'd have supported me only if I were wrong ?
b) it's a valid expectation since several years (for desktop assets).

Anyway, the point of this topic is not to know if these maps should be in the pack or not, it is irrelevant.
The point is to know if getting 5 negative reviews in a few hours and then none in a week, while other reviews didn't get any vote at all, is a natural behavior or a vote fraud.

 

@manutoo: you admitted you knew the pack didn't didn't have normal or specular maps before you bought it and you did complain in your review. I'll admit the 5 negative reviews of your review does seem suspicious, but your behavior is even more suspicious.

 

dbryson,
what are the pros and cons of this pack ?
for me :
pros = it looks good & it's well packed
cons = it misses specular & normal maps which means people must be cautious before to buy it to be sure it'll fit their lighting setup

Whether the author warns people about the lacking maps or not, whether I noticed it before or after the purchase, the cons are still the same, and an useful review should make other people aware of them, so they can take a thoughtful decision before buying the asset.
That's the purpose of the reviews, stating pros & cons, to help other buyers make informed purchase, no ?

Moreover, there's one special case : 1 of the amulets has strong shadow lines ; before buying, I wasn't sure it was in the diffuse texture or from a normal map (so I had to look all the assets, which is long & painful, and error-prone). So in that special case, my review is useful (hopefully! ), as it removes any doubt without requiring manual checking & guessing.

 

@manuto: You are so full of S***.

 

dbryson,
I like the "quality" of your argumentation...

and here what would have been a complaining review :
"Before to purchase this asset, I contacted the author to know if he was planning to add specular & normal maps to his pack, as it'd bring better rendering quality.
He then deceived me, telling me he'd send me these maps once I'd have purchased the pack, as he didn't want to bundle them with the pack, to avoid it to become too big.
The truth is that the maps he sent to me have been automatically created by ShaderMap, and their quality is sub-par as best, the specular maps can't be seriously called specular maps ; the normal maps are less catastrophic but are in no way near the quality of a real normal map created from high poly models, as it's mostly random bumpiness created from greyscale version of the diffuse maps.
I'd wish I'd have more money to hire an artist to create real quality stuff, but I'm stuck with this."

That is all true, but turned in a negative, dark way. (and I was smart enough to know he'd not send me quality maps as soon as I knew they'd be automatically created)
Now, you read again my review in the store, and you tell me how negative it is...

 

@manuto: F*** you!

 

manutoo
I can agree with most of what you replied, everyone knows that normal and specular maps would improve assets.
With the majority of the users using these loot assets that end up occupying very little screen space at the and, I have not done any of these maps.

I will most certainly explore and try include more of such file types in future.

Like I came back with my first response, your base unhappiness started with the fact that within 10 hours of your review that 5 down-votes of an item that is part of a MADNESS SALE that 1000's of page views happen inside even an hour possible. I have given several very plausible explanations for these.

Whether you want to believe that none of them are possible to be the reason for that only you can decide that.

I have explained myself on every point.
The fact of the matter through the very reaction of some of the replies on this post asking for vote rigging, to a direct competitor adding several accusations (and we can see why), you have caused the review and its up and down-voting to have become that, rigged and untrue reflection of the average shopper.

I have not hidden any names or aliases, I know they fully searchable and findable.

I am not M4K or many of the other superb asset providers on the store, I am just me I absolutely love the work of a great many publishers on the store and see many of them as a benchmark toward to strive to

I am glad that you like the assets, as I said in my email to you last night, I want happy customers, if there is any way that I can convert you to a happy customer then please let me know.

Cheers
Cobus

 

just want to clarify something, it is Shadermap, the name of the tool and I explained that in the email before you bought the asset, that I would pop them into the tool and supply you with the output that it would give me, I never said that I am going to use some kind of Zbrush or other method to make and generate these, I did supply to you what I said I would supply to you.

Cheers
Cobus

 

MutantGopher, I only want to grow relationships even with other publishers
At the end a healthy marketplace require many publishers, I have no interest in trying to push anyone down, so can we be friends?

 

That is 100% the reason for my own, ONE down vote that I cast.

Your review started good and honest and positive about what was in the actual pack and THANKS for that.
But then the second part in my opinion became irrelevant, and therefor "not useful"
You full knowingly, since the list of files in the pack shows this and you emailed me even in private then reviewed something that was not in the package.

Again, out of 1000's of passer by's, for 4 others to also have that perspective, how on earth is that suspicious

Sorry my opinion is not the same as yours...

 

S4G4N,
I'm already an happy customer. I surely won't use everything in your pack, but as it was on sale, I still got a good deal. I created the most needed specular maps by myself, so it looks ok enough in my game (it'd be better if done by a real skilled artist, though).
And if you do assets that I need in the future, I'll likely buy them.

>> just want to clarify something, it is Shadermap

Sorry, my mistake, I corrected that !

>> Again, out of 1000's of passer by's, for 4 others to also have that perspective, how on earth is that suspicious

These facts are, though :
- they all voted within hours of my review, but no one voted anymore after that
- no one voted for any other reviews
- my review was hidden, people had actually to click on "see all reviews" to notice it
- my similar other review on another daily sale asset didn't get any vote
- the other slightly critical technical reviews on this asset and your other assets have been heavily down-voted while they offer interested feedbacks
- you negatively reviewed a direct concurrent
- you exchanged nice reviews with another store seller (which is not a direct concurrent)

Anyway, there's no hard proof and the final point of this topic is not really about you.
The final point is that tampering votes & reviews is actually easy, and Unity should try to come up with solutions to prevent defiance against the reviews in the long term. (the Unity Asset Store is just too great to let it slide ! )

EDIT:
one more point... If someone else asked you about getting these maps, but this someone didn't know the technicality behind their creation, he'd have probably felt deceived by your proposal once he'd have gotten the maps. Me, I didn't expect you'd send me anything, and I knew the limitations of ShaderMap, so no harm done on my side, but next time, you might want to take more precautions (learning what exactly does a specular map and how it works might be a good 1st step! )

 

Thanks for this, YAY another happy customer

Sorry if my own no vote made you feel that way, it is just the perspective that I have of that matter, but lets put that to bed and move forward.

I really really want to build relationships, not break them down, I am sorry for the offense that I have presented.
I must just calm down and rather respond slower

I have also realized that that I can not keep 100% of the users happy, I am going to try damn hard, I do hope to see you around and use more of my assets, I learn with each project, that is what I went back to the past projects and updated them with much needed polish because I knew much less back then and surely don't know enough at this moment.

I want to keep improving and provide better goods to the users.

Yes I earn an income from making assets, but I promise you, as a married man and a father of two, I want to go and sleep and know that I made a difference to someone out there to place affordable assets to the best of my skills in there hands and assist them to build on there dreams and hopes they have.

Again, sorry about my rants over the course of our coms

PS I went and added a very positive review to the other package earlier this morning
He did come back and updated the package I believe to the best of his skills so he needed to be commended for that.

Cheers
Cobus

 

@dbryson: that sort of behavior is unacceptable.

--Eric

 

But previously you stated that you KNEW there were no normalmaps

Now if that isn't a targeted derailment of the argument onto a personal .. rail.. i don't know what

You may have been a little suspicious when you created this thread but it seems this argument (at least for you) has evolved into something that has to be won.. Which in my opinion is deplorable.

And here's why: I'm neither a customer nor associate of s4g4n yet i feel that i have to jump into this developing clusterfuck. Why? I've checked out his assets from a visually qualitative, quantitative and in relational cost perspective and have come to the conclusion that he is in fact a good publisher.
Now.. his assets may only contain diffuse/albedo maps but for someone strictly targeting the mobile market that's a plus. Less time to update and nothing to clean up/modify after import. He keeps a consistent art-style across his asset packs, which i think is a big plus for a lot of people. He pushes free additional content in updates? Dude..

So now that you know why I'd classify him as a good publisher let me elaborate on why i feel the need to "defend" him: A lot if not more than 95% of asset-store publishers do their work on their assets in their off hours. After their actual job. That requires commitment which in turn requires motivation. Motivation is like water. And seeing a sponge like you suck up a "good guys" motivation just for the sake of winning an argument is something i abhor.

Looking at the assets even for a short while, noting the effect-maps used, the geometry budget it's clearly visible they are meant for use in mobile projects and not Crysis-4.
Yet you want to use them in your desktop targeted project and feel the need to annotate the lack of additional maps in the pack's review section.

Interresting

 

plus desktop games do not always require normal/spec/whathaveyou maps.
It all depends on the art style. If the pack does not include what you need from it then do not purchase it. If you purchased in error, thinking it would include those things, then request a refund.

I'm a publisher too and often see people buy something just to come with shopping basket of stuff thy want added. Heck, I even get this on my free assets. Do people think we publishers got endless free time or that it should all be spend on work?

@manutoo. That last bit is not directed at you, just a bit of a rant from an over worked publisher. I do not think your review was that bad.

 

Graph,
yes, I knew there was no spec & normal maps from the screenshots, but I had some little doubts on 1 model, so I had to check through the whole asset list, which is long & error prone. Is it so hard to understand ?

Basically, I said in my review : "his pack is the best one, and it'd be even better with spec & normal maps". That's a motivation killer for you ? Read my "complaining review" above and try not to fall into depression.

And about the quality of S4G4N's assets, here an answer from him, by email (about the maps before I bought anything) :

And heck, he was right, it's not just for mobile. Quality is good enough for desktop if the objects aren't too big on the screen ; but unfortunately, not in all lighting conditions, as I explained in my review.
It'd be nice to finish this topic with me defending the quality of his assets..!

 

Please lock this thread !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

OK.

Also swearing and arguing and bitching is completely unacceptable from all concerned, you should be ashamed of yourselves.